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This article is intended to mimic the style of the Jehovah's Witness book 'What Does the Bible really teach?' in order to potentially reason through specific ideas about the Trinity. You might like to print this page so you can read through it together with them, discuss it, and see whether you can come to any agreements on what has been taught. You can even use their own New World Translation of the Bible to reference the Scripture. What is the Trinity? The trinity, better referred to as the tri-unity, is a core doctrine of most denominations of Christianity. The most basic and common description is roughly as follows: The Father, The Word, and The Holy Spirit are three eternal persons, but one being in one essence. This description can understandably be quite difficult to comprehend, as there is nothing in the world that can be accurately compared to it. Usually when we see three people, we immediately recognise three entirely separate beings. But God is not human, or animal, or even biological, so the same assumption need not apply to him. How can we most simply describe the doctrine of the trinity? The way we have come to know of this doctrine is through the teaching of the Bible. Throughout the New Testament in particular, three truths become readily apparent. They are as follows: - There is only one God. - Three persons are described as God. - The three persons are distinct from each other. These three statements describe the tri-unity. We shall soon look into how the Bible presents this information to us, but first it may help to clarify some of the common misunderstandings of what the doctrine is. The doctrine of the tri-unity is the combination of the three statements above. If a belief is not all three of these together, then it is not the tri-unity, and is considered a false teaching. Say, if we were to remove the third statement, we would be left with "1) There is only one God " and "2) Three persons are described as God These two statements when taken alone do not represent the tri-unity. These two alone would describe something called Modalism, where for example God at some point in time ceases to be the Father, and becomes the Word, and then changes back at will. This can be compared to a human male who while at home is in the role of the father to his family, but at work is in the role of doctor. The simple reason to reject this doctrine of Modalism, is that we often read about interactions between the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit (Matthew 3:16, John 14:26, Acts 10:38). This could not happen if one person was switching between roles. Why do we reject Modalism? If we were to remove the first statement, we would be left with "2) Three persons are described as God " and "3) The three persons are distinct from each other This doctrine is known as Polytheism, or more simply: the belief in many gods. You will be hard pressed to find Christians who believe that there is more than one god, as the Bible could hardly be clearer that Jehovah alone is God (Isaiah 46:9, Mark 12:29). Why do we reject Polytheism? If we were to remove the second statement, we would be left with "1) There is only one God " and "3) The three persons are distinct from each other These two statements go some way to describe a doctrine known as Arianism. Arianism denies that Jesus or the Holy Spirit are described as God, but are at best, subordinate divine beings. The view was first proposed by Arius, a priest in Alexandria in the 4th century, but was denounced by the Council of Nicea in 325AD who affirmed the tri-unity. They referred to Jesus as "God from God, Light from Light, True God from True God, begotten not made (not created), and One in essence with the Father." The view of the Council was that the doctrine of the trinity had been passed down to them from the earliest disciples through the church fathers. In the second century Tertullian wrote: "unity in trinity, interrelating the three, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. They are three, not in dignity, but in degree, not in substance but in form, not in power but in kind. They are of one substance and power, because there is one God from whom these degrees, forms and kinds devolve in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. (Adversus Praxean 23; PL 2.156-7). Irenaeus, who was a student of Polycarp who himself was a student of John the Apostle, wrote "to Christ Jesus, our Lord, and God, and Saviour, and King, according to the will of the invisible Father, ‘every knee should bow, " (Against Heresies X.l) In the first century Ignatius of Antioch wrote " There is one Physician who is possessed both of flesh and spirit; both made and not made; God existing in flesh; true life in death; both of Mary and of God; first possible and then impossible,- even Jesus Christ our Lord " (Epistle to the Ephesians). Did Tertullian, Irenaeus, Ignatius, and the Council of Nicea believe that Jesus was God himself? Despite it having been condemned as a heresy soon after it was first proposed, there are a number of groups who hold the Arian belief today, but we shall go on to see what the Bible tells us. Could it be that the Council of Nicea got it wrong? WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES - Jehovah is the only God. - The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit interact with one another. (Matthew 3:16, John 14:26, Acts 10:38) Does the Trinity Make Sense? One of the issues that many people have with the doctrine of the tri-unity is that it is very difficult to understand. In and of itself, this is very true. It is extremely hard to fully grasp the concept of three persons in one essence, and even more troublesome to explain it. However, although the doctrine itself is not easy to explain or comprehend, it does make sense of what the Bible teaches us, as well as a number of logical issues to do with the nature of God. For instance, Jesus is very often referred to as the Son of God, or indeed the Son of the Father (Luke 3:22, John 1:34, Romans 1:4). When a human has a son, that son is also human. When a cat has a son, that son is also a cat. Therefore, if God has a son, that son should be God. We know from the Old Testament that Jehovah alone is God. We also know that the description of Jehovah is that he is eternal (Genesis 21:33), without an equal (Isaiah 44:8), and perfect (Deuteronomy 32:4). What are some of the attributes that make Jehovah unique? Now, if God had a son who began to exist at a certain point in time, then he would not be eternal, so he would not be God's equal, and so he would not be perfect. If God's son was none of these things, he would not be God. This is exactly what Arianists believe. If God's son is not God, then Jehovah being the Father of Jesus could be compared to a human becoming father to a cat. God as creator of all things of course (Isaiah 44:24, Isaiah 45:11-13) was the original designer of humans and cats alike, but Jesus is described as being begotten not made. 'John 3:16' refers to Jesus as God's 'only-begotten son'. The Greek word for 'begotten' in this passage is 'monogenes' (uovoYevής We will see more about the word 'begotten' later, but here we can see that the choice to use the phrase 'only-begotten' is designed to contrast with the words 'created' (Greek: 'ktizó' (ktίZw )) or 'made' (Greek: 'poieō' (πoιέw)) used for the world and humankind (Matthew 19:4, Colossians 1:16). Who created all things? In 'Hebrews 11:17' we see that the phrase 'only-begotten' or 'monogenes' appears again. However in this instance, it describes Isaac as being the only-begotten of Abraham. We know that Isaac was in fact Abraham's second son, after Ishmael (Genesis 16:16, Genesis 21:5). Because we know that Isaac was born to Abraham, and not created by him, and we also know that Isaac had a special relationship with his father that Ishmael did not have, (Genesis 17:19-21) we can see that 'monogenes' has a very particular meaning. The word 'monogenes' comes from the Greek root words 'monos' (only) and 'genos' (kind), so the most accurate meaning would be something like "one of a kind". So just as Isaac could accurately be described as a 'one of a kind' son to Abraham, Jesus is also described as a 'one of a kind' son to Jehovah. Some have said that the root word is not 'genos ' but rather 'gennao' ('born'), however, as we have seen, this translation does not fit with Abraham's story. Isaac was not Abraham's 'only born' son. What does the Greek word 'monogenes' mean? As Jesus is God's one of a kind son, who was begotten and not created, it makes sense that these two persons are of the same essence. It could be said by way of analogy that they are of the same species, and that each member of the species 'God' has the attributes of being eternal, unique, and perfect. Of course, humans and angels are sometimes referred to as 'sons of God', however, Jesus' position as 'only-begotten', or 'one of a kind' certainly sets him apart from any other being as something truly unique. Who is God's unique, one of a kind son? Other aspects of God's nature brings us to a second problem with not accepting the tri-unity doctrine. God is the embodiment of love (1 John 4:8). God is also self sufficient (Acts 17:24-25), which means he needs nothing. He has everything he needs within himself. On any non-trinitarian type of monotheism, this makes for a contradiction. If God is a being of love, then he would need someone to express that love to, and also someone to receive love from, or else he would suffer frustration from missing another person to share his loving nature with. The doctrine of the tri-unity allows God to have a loving relationship within the three persons of the Godhead without any need for extra beings outside of himself. A monotheism that does not have three or even two divine persons within a Godhead, would therefore need something, and so would not be self-sufficient. God would have to create another being before he could express and satisfy his loving nature. He would need there to always be at least one other being in existence to be complete. If God is self-sufficient would he ever need anything outside of himself? Even though the tri-unity may seem to be a confusing doctrine, we can see that it makes sense of God's unique nature. In 'Isaiah. God declares, "For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so my ways are higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts". We should not be surprised if our limited minds are not fully capable of understanding God and his infinite and eternal being. WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES - Jehovah is eternal (Genesis 21:33), without an equal (Isaiah 44:8), and perfect (Deuteronomy 32:4). - Jehovah created all things alone. - Jesus is Jehovah's one of a kind son. - Jehovah is self sufficient. Is Jesus God? The question of Jesus' identity is central to any Christian theology. Trinitarians believe that Jesus is God incarnate, and so the infinite value of his life covers the uncountable sins of all mortal humans. Others believe that Jesus was a man who lived a perfect life, and his sacrifice simply repaid the balance against the sin of the first man Adam, who caused the fall of mankind. God's word is our ultimate authority on the truth about Jesus, and so we must trust it to inform our own knowledge and beliefs. It has been preserved for us as the Holy Bible. Other than God himself, there is nothing we should trust more than his Bible. What is the ultimate authority on the truth about Christianity? The New Testament is where we discover most of our information about Jesus. While the Old Testament contains several prophecies about the coming Messiah, the New Testament Gospels are historical accounts of his life and teachings according to his disciples, while the Epistles offer some further information about him and what he taught. Within them we see that Jesus had several conversations with Jewish leaders and authorities who opposed him. In 'Mark 2:5-7' Jesus forgave the sin of a paralysed man, and as he did so, the Jewish scribes remarked that only God has the right to do that. A number of events like this including in 'John 5:16-18', 'John 8:58-59', and 'John 10:30-33', caused the Jewish leaders to believe that Jesus was claiming to be equal to God. In some cases they reacted violently and tried to kill him. What did the Pharisees and other Jewish leaders think Jesus was claiming to be? This raises some questions. If Jesus was not God, but a perfect man, would he intentionally deceive the Jews to make him think that he was equal to God? Or would he behave in a way that would not cause them to react with anger and violence? Jesus' death on the cross was handed to him on the charge of blasphemy (Matthew 9:2-3, Matthew 26:62-65, John 19:7). According to 'Leviticus 24:16' "the abuser of Jehovah's name should be put to death without fail". So to the strict Jewish leaders, Jesus' blasphemy against God himself meant that he deserved the death penalty. To a trinitarian, the reading of these passages is that Jesus rightfully said that he was God, and equal to the Father. The Jewish leaders who did not believe it became angry and wrongfully executed him for blaspheming against Jehovah. The only reading of this for someone who does not believe that Jesus was God, is that Jesus allowed the Jews to be deceived in order to get himself crucified. It would seem that the perfect man who lies is something of a contradiction (1 Peter 2:21-22). Can Jesus lie? Jesus was executed by the Jewish Sanhedrin (leaders) charged with the blasphemy of claiming to be equal with God. Either Jesus truly was equal to God, and the Sanhedrin were mistaken, or Jesus was not equal to God and the Sanhedrin executed him justly according to their laws because he claimed to be so. Could it really be the case that Jesus deceived the Sanhedrin? Jesus can not lie. He is 'the truth' (John 14:6). He explains in 'Matthew 13:10-15' that those who do not understand him are ones who are closed minded and unwilling to hear anything that doesn't match with what they already believe. He uses parables and illustrations to tell the truth, but only those with open minds and hearts will grasp what he is saying. He does not lie, so if people believe the wrong things about him, it is because of their own presumptions. So we see the conundrum. Either: - Jesus truly is equal God, and the Sanhedrin refused to believe it and had him executed. - Jesus led the Sanhedrin to believe that he was claiming to be equal to God when he was not, and they justly executed him for blasphemy. For option (2) to be correct, Jesus would have had to have said something that was completely true, but that he also knew that the Sanhedrin would twist the meaning of, and then take it to be blasphemous and false. So he would be using truth as a form of deception. But we know from '1 Peter 2:22' that deception was not found in his mouth. In this case then, it would seem that option (2) is completely out of the question. Would Jesus intentionally deceive anybody? According to Old Testament prophecies, it would seem that the trinitarian reading makes more sense of these claims. 'Isaiah 9:6' for example reads "For a child has been born to us... His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace This verse is an obvious reference to Jesus and is very clear from a trinitarian point of view. But for those who deny the tri-unity, it raises problems. Would a created being be referred to as 'eternal'? Would a perfect man be called 'God'? Some Old Testament passages are used in a similar way to tell us who Jesus really is. Psalm 102 is a prayer to Jehovah which speaks of his immortality compared to the mortality of mankind. Read 'Psalm 102:24-27' here: "I said: “O my God, Do not do away with me in the middle of my life, You whose years span all generations. Long ago you laid the foundations of the earth, And the heavens are the work of your hands. They will perish, but you will remain; Just like a garment they will all wear out. Just like clothing you will replace them, and they will pass away. But you are the same, and your years will never end." Who does Psalm 102 say laid the foundations of the earth and will never perish? We find this passage quoted in the New Testament book of Hebrews Chapter 1. Read 'Hebrews 1:5,8,10-12' here: “For example, to which one of the angels did God ever say: “You are my son; today I have become your father”? But about the Son, he says: “God is your throne forever and ever, and the sceptre of your Kingdom is the sceptre of uprightness"... And: “At the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the works of your hands. They will perish, but you will remain; and just like a garment, they will all wear out, and you will wrap them up just as a cloak, as a garment, and they will be changed. But you are the same, and your years will never come to an end.” Who is being quoted in this passage in Hebrews? Who does Hebrews 1 say laid the foundations of the earth and will never perish? Writing here about Jesus, Paul quotes Jehovah, who is himself quoting a passage from a Psalm which clearly speaks of God. If Paul is right, then that means that Jesus is Jehovah God. It is of interest to note that in other translations 'Hebrews 1:5' is translated as 'I have begotten you', from the Greek 'gegenneka' (YeYevvnka). Previously we saw how the word 'begotten' is often translated from the Greek word 'monogenes' meaning 'one of a kind'. In many other places the English translations use the word 'begotten' in place of the Greek word 'gegenneka'. However 'monogenes' and 'gegenneka' mean different things, so in this case the English translations can cause unnecessary confusion. The 'Hebrews 1:5' verse is a quote from 'Psalm 2:7', the only difference being that Hebrews was written in Greek, while the Psalm was written in Hebrew. The word translated to 'gegenneka' from the Hebrew is 'ildthi·k' (יְלִדְתִּיךָ) from the root word 'yalad' (יָלַד). The basic definition of these words is 'to generate'. In 'Zephaniah 2:2' the word 'yalad' is translated to mean 'takes effect' and refers to a decree. So in this context, the decree generates an effect. In 'Job 38:28' 'yalad' is translated to ask who 'fathers' or 'begets' the rain. Obviously nobody does, because it is a naturally generated effect, or seeing as God is the creator of nature, then it could be fair to say that he generates it. 'Proverbs 27:1' uses the word 'yalad' to describe the events that a day would bring forth. The use of the word 'yalad' gives the impression of one thing coming naturally from a first, but with a sense of union. You can not separate events from a day and you can not separate rain from the clouds. As this Hebrew word 'yalad' and Greek word 'gegenneka' mean 'to generate', it is not entirely accurate to translate them in a way that suggests birth or fatherhood. The words more accurately describe how a flame begets smoke. As long as the flame exists, it will generate the smoke. In the same way it is said that God the Father generates the Son. The Son is a separate person, but they share their essence in one being and one entity. What does the Greek word 'gegenneka' mean? We see from these passages a number of ways that Jesus is identified as God. We have also seen that the Sanhedrin believed that Jesus claimed to be equal to God, and that the church fathers in the following centuries also taught the tri-unity. We have even seen a quote from Jehovah himself stating that Jesus is God. It should be no surprise then to find that Jesus' apostles and disciples recognised that Jesus was Jehovah. Paul tells us in 'Colossians 2:9' that "in him all the fullness of the divine quality dwells bodily Could 'all the fullness' of divinity exist in anybody but God himself? In 'John 20:28', the apostle Thomas after receiving proof that Jesus was raised from the dead calls him "My Lord and my God! 'Peter 1:1' refers to Jesus as God and saviour. In 'Acts 2:24', Peter also tells us that it was impossible for Jesus to be held by death, but we know full well that men can die and be lost forever (Matthew 10:28). So if Jesus was merely a man, death would have been a possibility. 'John 1:3' reads "All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence As we know and have previously seen from 'Isaiah 44:24', it was Jehovah who created all things, so John clearly identifies Jesus (the Word) with Jehovah. Is it possible for a created being to have created all things that were created? The passage in 'Isaiah 40:3' is about a voice calling out in the wilderness announcing the coming of Jehovah, as verse 9 confirms "Here is your God This passage is later referenced in each of the Gospels where we find that John the Baptist is the one calling out in the wilderness as he announces Jesus coming after him (Matthew 3:3,11, Mark 1:1-3, Luke 3:2-4,15-16, John 1:15, John 1:19-28). If John the Baptist was truly the 'voice calling out in the wilderness', yet he was announcing the arrival of Jesus, then it is clear that Jesus is 'your God' from Isaiah 40:9. Whose coming is being announced in Isaiah 40? Whose coming is being announced by John the Baptist? Within God's Bible it is clear that the leading apostles were convinced that Jesus was Jehovah himself manifest in the flesh. The reason for their belief was that Jesus himself taught them this as fact. He did this through various actions that his followers knew could only be accomplished by Jehovah. We have already seen how Jesus forgave the sins of a paralysed man (Mark 2:5-7), but there are several other examples too. In 'Mark 9:25-29', Jesus commands a demon to come out of a child. The disciples tell him that they were not able to do it when they had tried, so Jesus told them that only God was able to perform such exorcisms. In light of Jesus having performed the exorcism, and then telling his friends that only God could do such things, would that not be a hint at who he identified himself as? Does God allow his followers to worship or bow to other gods or beings? What things did Jesus do that only God could do? Jesus also accepts the worship of his followers. In several passages (Matthew 2:2, Matthew 2:8, Matthew 2:11, Matthew 14:33, Matthew 28:9, Matthew 28:17, John 9:38, Hebrews 1:6 etc) we see that not only his followers, but even angels worship Jesus. 'John 9:38' reads "He said: "I do put faith in him, Lord." And he did obeisance to him.". But in 'Acts 10:25-26', Peter receives the same treatment and tells the man who bowed to him that he should not do so to other men. The word translated from the Greek to 'obesiance' is 'proskyneō' (πpoσkuvέw), and is often translated elsewhere as 'worship' usually in regards to Jehovah (e.g. Luke 4:8). In 'Revelation 19:10' John the Apostle bows to worship an angel, (again using the word 'proskyneō') but like Peter, the angel tells him that worship is only for God. Unlike Peter and the angel, Jesus never warns his disciples that they should not worship or bow to him. He accepts what they are doing on every occasion. If Jesus was truly the Messiah and saviour, and nothing more than God's perfect man, would he accept the worship and respect that only God deserved (Exodus 34:14)? Jesus also makes his identity known by claiming certain titles that can only truly be applied to Jehovah. In 'Isaiah 44:6' and 'Isaiah 48:12' Jehovah claims the title 'the first and the last'. This is quite obviously a title that could only be held by one being. It is impossible to have two firsts or two lasts in this context. The title is a way of portraying his eternal nature and also his being the source of all other things. However, in 'Revelation 1:17-18' and 'Revelation 2:8' Jesus unmistakeably uses the title 'the first and the last' to refer to himself. Who is 'the first and the last' in Isaiah? Who is 'the first and the last' in Revelation? The title 'the first and the last' also appears in 'Revelation 22:12-16' and once again refers to Jesus, who is speaking about himself. In this passage 'the first and the last' is identified as being the same as 'the Alpha and Omega', which carries a similar meaning. In 'Revelation 21:6-7', we see that God is the Alpha and Omega. There could not possibly be two infinite, all encompassing beings, yet here in God's word the Bible we have Jesus claiming the title that only Jehovah has a right to. This scripture tells us that Jesus is God. There is no other plausible way to interpret this information. If Jesus is 'the first and the last', and 'the first and the last' is the 'Alpha and the Omega', and the 'Alpha and the Omega' is Jehovah, that can only mean that Jesus is Jehovah. Who is 'the Alpha and Omega' in Revelation 22? Who is 'the Alpha and Omega' in Revelation 21? Is it possible for there to be more than one Alpha and Omega? In 'Revelation 19:16' Jesus is referred to as the 'king of kings and lord of lords'. Once again, these are titles that simply can not be shared by two beings. So to a trinitarian, it is no surprise to read Jehovah claim the title 'lord of lords' in 'Deuteronomy 10:17' or 'king of kings' in '1 Timothy 6:15-16'. Who is 'the lord of lords' in Revelation 19? Who is 'the lord of lords' in Deuteronomy 10? Famously we know of Jesus as our Lord and Saviour. Through Jesus our salvation from sin has been assured (Acts 4:10-12, Titus 2:13). However reading through Isaiah once again tells us that it is Jehovah himself who is our Saviour (Isaiah 43:11-12, Isaiah 45:21-22). God makes it perfectly clear that he alone is the Saviour. No one else could ever take on that role. Who is our saviour as described in Acts and Titus? Who is our saviour as described in Isaiah? We regularly see in our English translations Jesus referred to as 'Lord' or the Greek 'kyrios' (kύpιoς) (Matthew 7:21, Matthew 12:8, Matthew 15:22, Mark 16:19, Luke 5:8 etc). This title is also used for Jehovah, most notably in 'Matthew 22:44' where the same word is used twice, first in reference to God, and secondly in reference to Jesus. The verse, which reads "Jehovah said to my Lord ", is a quote from 'Psalm 110:1' which reads "Jehovah declared to my Lord In the Psalm, two words are used instead of the single one. 'Jehovah' is from the tetragrammaton 'YHWH', while 'Lord' translates from the Hebrew word 'Adonai'. The tetragrammaton never appears in the New Testament Greek texts, and is always translated either 'kyrios' which means 'lord' or 'theos' (θeός) which means 'God'. It is curious that in this instance, the word 'lord' is used for both Jehovah and Jesus rather than including the word 'theos', which might indicate a clearer distinction between the two, if there was meant to be one. 'Lord' or 'kyrios' is obviously a title, and not a proper name, so it can be given to two people, but it does suggest that the two being referred to hold the same rank. As 'kyrios' is a title and not a name, it is inaccurate to translate it as 'Jehovah', though in the cases where it refers to him, this translation choice can be understood. What does 'kyrios' mean? What does 'theos' mean? Interestingly though, we see something of note in the Septuagint. The Septuagint is a Greek translation of the Old Testament which was completed in the century leading up to 132BC. In this translation there are many instances of the tetragrammaton or 'YHWH' being translated as 'kyrios'. The choice in the New Testament to take a word previously used as a direct translation of God's name and apply it to Jesus throughout could be a very clear indication of what the apostles believed about his identity. In '1 Corinthians 8:6' we see the Father referred to as 'God' (theos), while Jesus is referred to as 'Lord' (kyrios). However this verse comes within the context of Paul explaining the difference between the Greek polytheistic religion and his own monotheistic religion. His goal is to discourage worship of idols, and to focus on the one true God. So if Jesus is not God, then for Paul to mention him in this passage would be confusing to his readers. The verse '1 Corinthians 8:6' is also one of a number that refers to Jesus as 'the one Lord' (Jude 4, Ephesians 3:1 then 4:1,5). We could at this point remind ourselves that Jehovah was called Lord by Jesus himself in 'Matthew 22:44'. If there is only one Lord, and both Jesus and Jehovah receive that title regularly, this indicates that they are one. How many 'Lord's are there? At the very least we can see that the word 'kyrios' can very easily refer to either Jehovah or Jesus. In order to correctly translate the word so that it represents the correct person, checking the context of the word becomes of high importance. In many of Paul's letters this task can be quite difficult as he often seems to use the titles of God and Jesus interchangeably (e.g. Romans 14:3-9). For a trinitarian who sees Jehovah and Jesus as one and the same Lord and God, this is not a problem. For a non-trinitarian whose belief is that Jehovah and Jesus are completely separate, then clarifying which 'Lord' is being spoken of at any time is vitally important. In one particular place there seems to be a controversial choice in the 'New World Translation'. A read through of 'Revelation 1:1-8' tells us that this section is the introduction of the book which follows. In verse 8, the NWT translates 'kyrios' to 'Jehovah', but the context of the passage would strongly suggest that this a mistake. Not least because we know that 'kyrios' is not God's name, but simply the title 'Lord'. Verse 1 informs us that Revelation is a direct message from Jesus Christ given to the apostle John, passed on after God 'theos' gave it to him. Verse 7 has John exclaiming that Jesus is coming. This is unmistakably Jesus both in light of verse 1 and because it describes him as being 'pierced' and 'coming with the clouds'. The very next verse after John announces the arrival of Jesus is speech: "I am the Alpha and Omega, ... the One who is and who was and who is coming, the Almighty. " The Greek text tells us that this line of speech was said by the 'kyrios ho theos' or 'Lord God'. It does not say 'YHWH theos' which would certainly reference Jehovah. As the text simply says 'kyrios' or 'Lord', we then must use the context of the passage to decipher who the 'Lord' is. We already know that Jesus is referred to as 'God' in 'Isaiah 9:6' and 'John 1:1' and we have already seen that both Jesus and Jehovah are 'the one Lord'. From the very apparent clues of Verse 7, it should be extremely clear that Verse 8 refers to Jesus. He is announced, and then he speaks. Verse 7 says 'he is coming ', while Verse 8 says "I am... the One... who is coming It is a perfect match. We should also recall that in 'Revelation 22', Jesus was named 'the Alpha and Omega'. (See Appendix for 'Rev 1' regarding who is coming). So, given the clear context that reveals 'Revelation 1:8' is Jesus speaking of himself, we also learn that Jesus claims the title 'the Almighty', which undeniably is a title that only Jehovah himself may claim. 'Colossians 1:15' describes Jesus as 'the image of the invisible God (See Appendix for 'Col 1:16-19') This is a description of one of Jesus' roles within the tri-unity. God in his full divine glory can not be seen by the living (Exodus 33:20), and has not been seen (1 John 4:12), and yet there are those who have seen him (Genesis 32:30), and will see him (Matthew 5:8). If Jesus is not Jehovah, then these Biblical passages make for an obvious contradiction. In the trinitarian view however, these verses make perfect sense. The Son, who is the visible image of God, can be seen by our eyes. Any person in the Bible who saw God and lived had met with the Son. 'Exodus 33:20' very clearly states in reference to Jehovah: "You cannot see my face, for no man can see me and live Can a man see the face of Jehovah and live? Earlier in that same chapter, we see the beginning of the conversation. Verse 11 is also very clear about what took place: "Jehovah spoke to Moses face-to-face, just as one man would speak to another man Within the context of a single conversation, we either have here a glaring contradiction, or an early Old Testament example of the tri-unity in action. Who did Moses speak with face-to-face? If the face of Jehovah can not be seen, then it would be impossible for Moses to speak with him face-to-face. But if the face of the Father can not be seen, it is perfectly reasonable for the Son, who is the visible image of the invisible God, to meet face-to-face. This would make sense of the various other times that Jehovah appeared in human form to meet his chosen people, e.g. the time he wrestled Jacob (Genesis:32:22-32), the time Abraham met him at Mamre (Genesis 18:1-2), and the times he walked with Adam in Eden (Genesis 3:8). There are many more examples of passages which indicate that Jesus shared titles, attributes, and abilities with the Father, but this selection should be more than enough to make it a very reasonable conclusion that Jesus was God himself manifest in the flesh. WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES - The Sanhedrin and Jewish leaders believed that Jesus claimed to be equal to God. - Jesus can not lie. (1 Peter 2:22) Neither can God. - Jesus is eternal. (Isaiah 9:6) - Jesus did things that only God could do such as forgive sins and drive away demons. - Jesus laid the foundations of the earth and will not perish or fade away like a garment. - Jesus created all things. - Jesus' disciples believed that he was God. - Jesus accepted worship. (Matthew 28:17, John 9:38, Hebrews 1:6) - Jesus was worshipped in exactly the same way as the Father. (Revelation 5:11-14) - Jesus is called 'the first and the last', a title only God can hold. (Isaiah 44:6, Revelation 1:17-18) - Jesus is called 'the Alpha and Omega', another title exclusive to God. (Revelation 21:6-7, Revelation 22:12-16) - Jesus and God share the titles 'lord of lords' and 'king of kings'. (Revelation 19:16, Deuteronomy 10:17, 1 Timothy 6:15-16) - Jesus and God both are the one and only saviour. - Jesus is Almighty. (Revelation 1:8) - Jesus is Jehovah. If Jesus is God, why does he say the Father is greater than he is? One of the main hurdles to accepting the equality of Jesus and the Father is that there are several examples in the New Testament of Jesus telling people that the Father is greater than he is. Despite the overwhelming Gospel evidence that tells us that Jesus is equal to the Father, these passages seem to contradict that conclusion. Here are a few examples: - "Concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father." -- Matthew 24:36 - "Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing." - "I am going to the Father, for Father is greater than I am." So we see from Jesus' own mouth that he tells us that the Father is more powerful and more knowledgeable than he is. When we read Scripture, we must keep in mind that it is all God's word, and that it does not contradict itself. Every verse must harmonise with every other verse. These verses seem to present a contradiction. We have seen that Jesus certainly is God, yet in these passages it seems that Jesus is something less than God. Can these facts be harmonised? The best way to interpret Scripture is to allow the clearer passages to inform our understanding of the less clear passages. In this case, it might be tempting to simply admit that the weight of evidence tells us that Jesus is God, and the contradictory verses are a mystery. But we do not have to do this. There are other passages in Scripture that explain this apparent contradiction clearly and remove the mystery altogether. Read 'Philippians 2:5-8' here: "Keep this mental attitude in you that was also in Christ Jesus, who, although he was existing in God’s form, gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God. No, but he emptied himself and took a slave’s form and became human. More than that, when he came as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to the point of death, yes, death on a torture stake." In this passage Paul speaks of Christ's existence before he became human, and explains the transformation. He tells us that Jesus was in the form of God, (theos) which is a strikingly clear statement that Jesus is equal to the Father. He then tells us that Jesus did not cling to his equality with God. Instead, he 'emptied himself' and became a servant and a human. In other words, Jesus, who was God, gave up his equality, and became human so that he could die. Jesus himself confirms this in 'John 17:5': "Father, glorify me at your side with the glory that I had alongside you before the world was". This simple statement speaks volumes about who Jesus is. He claims equal glory to the Father, when we know that God shares his glory with nobody, (Isaiah 42:8). He also claims to have existed before the world. The Greek word for 'world' here is 'kosmos' (kόσuoς), which actually refers to the entire system of existence, and so he would have been present 'in the beginning'. We see it echoed again in 'Hebrews 2:9-10': "But we do see Jesus, who was made a little lower than angels, now crowned with glory and honour for having suffered death, so that by God’s undeserved kindness he might taste death for everyone. For it was fitting that the one for whom and through whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the Chief Agent of their salvation perfect through sufferings." Jesus, who was fully God, had been made 'a little lower than angels' so that he could die to bring about the salvation of everyone. This also shows us how God has proved his love for us by his own standard. 'John 15:13' reads "No one has greater love than this, that someone should surrender his life in behalf of his friends". If God himself died for us, then he has shown us the greatest love there is. Although Paul explains Jesus' becoming human adequately, it is the opening section of John 1 that gives us the clearest picture of what happened. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. 2 This one was in the beginning with God. 3 All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence. What has come into existence 4 by means of him was life, and the life was the light of men ...9 The true light that gives light to every sort of man was about to come into the world. 10 He was in the world, and the world came into existence through him, but the world did not know him ... 14 So the Word became flesh and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory, a glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of divine favour and truth... 18 No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is at the Father’s side is the one who has explained Him." The first verse has a footnote next to 'a god' reading "or 'was divine'". This seems to be another mistake on the part of the translators. The words translated to 'God' and 'a god' are both 'theos', so both should simply be 'God'. 'Divine', which is an attribute that only belongs to God anyway, is a slightly different Greek word, which does not appear in this verse. 'Divine' would translate from 'theios' (θeῖoς). But even so, 'theios' is word derived from the word for God 'theos', and are impossible to separate. (See Appendix for 'John 1:1') Verse 2, tells us that the Word (or the Logos) existed 'in the beginning with God', once again affirming that they share an eternal existence. Verse 3 reminds us that the Word created all things, but we know that Jehovah created all things alone (Isaiah 44:24, Isaiah 45:11-13). Verse 4 is another strange translation choice. The Greek simply reads "In him was life", so the translator here has added a phrase which does not appear in the original ("What has come into existence by means of him"). This translation also makes less sense than the Greek. If Jesus had life within him, then he could gift that to mankind. But if Jesus created life, how was it that he was alive beforehand to do so? What does 'John1:1-4' tell us about Jesus? So in Verses 1 to 4, we see that Jesus is God, and existed eternally, created all things, and is the source of life. Verses 9 and 10 give us another title for Jesus, namely 'the true light', and also tell us that he was coming into the world. So the light which created all things, is the one coming into the world. Verse 14 tells us that the Word became flesh and lived among us, and so it becomes very clear that the same being who created us and gave us life, is the same one who came to Earth for our salvation. What does 'John 1:9-18' tell us about Jesus? Verse 18 finally tells us that nobody has seen God, but the 'only-begotten god' who became flesh and lived among us, is the one who has explained him to us. There is again a curious choice in translation in this verse, as the phrase 'only-begotten god' does not appear in the Greek. The Greek reads 'monogenes huios' (uovoYevής uἱός) which mean 'only-begotten son'. However, as the Son is God, this choice is not an issue. So from verses 9 to 18, we see the the Word became human and lived in the world so that he could teach us about Jehovah. Altogether the plain reading of the text informs us that Jesus, who is God, who created all things, brought life to all things, and exists eternally, became a human being and walked the Earth so he could teach us. These passages paint a clear picture of who Jesus is and what he did. He was fully God, but he emptied himself of his divinity and became a man. God can not die, and God can not be seen by men, but Jesus was able to do these things. Jesus died (John 19:33) and was the image of God (Hebrews 1:3). God is an infinite being, while man is extremely finite. Jesus, in becoming a man, limited himself in several ways. So while God the Father remained infinite, omnipotent, and omniscient, Jesus was restricted to the limitations of the human body. He was still God, but had self imposed handicaps. It is because of these limitations that Jesus can be God, and yet also say that the Father is greater than he is. WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES - The man Jesus was in some way lesser to God the Father. - Jesus was God before he was a man. - Before becoming a man, Jesus was equal to God the Father. (John 17:5, Philippians 2:5-7) - Jesus emptied himself of divinity. (Philippians 2:7) - Jesus was made a lesser being so that he could bring salvation to his people. (Hebrews 2:9) - When Jesus became a man, he became obedient to God the Father. (Philippians 2:8) - Jesus came to Earth to serve, not to be served by others. - After completing his work on Earth, Jesus will again share the glory of his Father. Is the Holy Spirit God? As we have firmly established that Jesus is Jehovah, we can now understand that despite being a complicated idea, it is true that God can be multiple persons while being one essence. The Holy Spirit is said to be the third member of the tri-unity. He is given equal standing alongside the Father and Son, in some vital passages. 'Matthew 28:19' reads: "Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit". This passage alone tells us that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit share a holy name. Notice how 'name' is singular. The name they share of course is 'Jehovah' (Isaiah 42:8, Matthew 6:9, John 17:11, Philippians 2:9). The identity of the Holy Spirit is slightly more difficult to grasp than those of the Father and the Word. We know that the Holy Spirit is a person from verses such as 'Acts 13:2' in which the Holy Spirit issues commands, 'John 14:26' in which the Holy Spirit teaches, 'Ephesians 4:30' in which we learn it can feel sadness, and 'Hebrews 10:15' in which we learn it will be a witness for us. How do we know that the Holy Spirit is a person? 'Ephesians 1:13-14' reads: "After you believed, you were sealed by means of him with the promised holy spirit, which is a token in advance of our inheritance". We can also remember that John the Baptist told his disciples that Jesus would "baptise you with holy spirit"(Matthew 3:11). So from these verses, we can gather that when we come to believe in Jesus and Jehovah, we are baptised with the Holy Spirit, which is a sign of God's promise to us. 'Titus 3:5' then adds that the Holy Spirit makes us new, which 'John 3:3-7' compares to like being 'born again'. In 'John 14:16-17' Jesus tells us that if we follow him, he will send us a 'helper' who will remain with us and in us. This 'helper' is the Holy Spirit (Romans 8:26-27). From this we gather that the simple explanation of who the Holy Spirit is, is that he is the person God sends to live inside us. Who is the Holy Spirit? The passage in 'Romans 8:9-11' is another example of Paul seemingly using the names of Jehovah and Jesus interchangeably. He speaks of God's spirit and Christ's spirit as though they are one and the same. "you are in harmony, not with the flesh, but with the spirit, if God's spirit truly dwells in you. But if anyone does not have Christ's spirit, this person does not belong to him." In 'Acts 5:3-4' Peter scolds Ananias for lying to the Holy Spirit. In his next breath he tells him that he has lied to God. Clearly Peter is treating the Holy Spirit and God as the same. He does this once more in '1 Peter 4:14'. Paul also equates the two in '2 Corinthians 3:17-18'. In 'Romans 8:11' he credits the Holy Spirit with the resurrection of Jesus. We have this further confirmed in multiple ways as the Holy Spirit has a number of attributes that only Jehovah has. In 'Romans 8:2', the Spirit is referred to as the one who gives life. In 'Job 33:4' we see that it is the Spirit who made men, and of course 'Genesis 1:2' informs us that he was present at the creation in the beginning. In much the same way as we see Old Testament passages about Jehovah being applied to the identity of Jesus in the New Testament, we find the same thing done for the Holy Spirit. 'Hebrews 3:7-11' quotes the Holy Spirit speaking. The words spoken by the Holy Spirit are quoted from 'Psalm 95', where the chapter is very clearly about our God and maker. These straight forward passages, as well as many others, tell us all that we need to know to conclude that the Holy Spirit is a third person, equal to the Father and Son, who are all Jehovah. How do we know that the Holy Spirit is equal to Jehovah? WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES - The Holy Spirit shares the holy name with the Father and Son. - The Holy Spirit is a person. (Acts 13:2, John 14:26, Ephesians 4:30, Hebrews 10:15) - The Holy Spirit is our personal seal guaranteeing our promise from God. - The Holy Spirit dwells within us. - The Holy Spirit is our guide and teacher. - The Holy Spirit is our creator. (Genesis 1:2, Job 33:4, Romans 8:2) - The Holy Spirit is Jehovah. (Acts 5:3-4, 2 Corinthians 17-18) From the Father, Through the Son, By the power of the Holy Spirit Understanding what is taught about the tri-unity in the Bible gives us an idea of the roles the persons of the Godhead play. Much of what they do can be summed up by the phrase "From the Father, Through the Son, By the power of the Holy Spirit". This phrase is a slight adaptation of what we learn from 'Ephesians 2:18' We can take creation as a prime example. All of creation came from the Father (James 1:17), through the Son (John 1:3), by the power of the Holy Spirit (Genesis 1:2, Psalm 104:30). In a similar way salvation came from the Father, through the Son (Jude 25), by the power of the Holy Spirit (Acts 10:38, Romans 8:2). The Son was sent from the Father (1 John 4:14), to earn our atonement through his death (Hebrews 10:10), and renew us by the power of the Holy Spirit (Hebrews 9:14, Titus 3:5). Our judgement is from the will of the Father through the Son (Romans 2:16), by the power of the Holy Spirit within us (John 16:7-11). And the Gospel message came from the Father, through the Son (Mark 1:14-15), by the power of the Holy Spirit (1 Thessalonians 1:5). APPENDIX John 1:1 'John 1:1' is for many the go-to place to show that Jesus and Jehovah are one. In the NIV it reads "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." It could hardly be clearer that the Word is God, yet also in some way separate to him. However in the NWT it reads "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god." This verse seems to say that Jesus is also a god, but not the one God, which would seem to suggest a form of polytheism, which is undeniably a false teaching. The reason most often cited for this choice in the NWT is due to the use of the definite article (or in layman's terms the word 'the'). Each time the 'Word' appears in the sentence it is joined with the Greek definite article 'ho'. This is also true of the first instance of 'God', which appears with the Greek definite article 'ton'. The second appearance of 'God' however has no definite article attached to it. The NWT translators conclude from this therefore that each time a definite article is used, it is being used in the sense of 'the one and only', while where it is not used, the lack of the definite article means that there is more than one subject (in this case 'god'). In other words, they conclude that there is a one and only Word, a one and only God, and because they are with one another, they could not possibly be the same, and so the Word must be a lesser god. There is a definite problem with this in that the word 'theos' is used to refer to both the Word, and to God, which would seem to connect them rather than separate them, but in this section, we will look at how the NWT has used the definite article. When we translate, sometimes we have to add or remove definite articles from the original text in order to make the language naturally flow in English. A prime example of this is actually in 'John 1:1'. The first two words in Greek are 'En arche' which mean 'In beginning'. There is no definite article there, but in English we are forced to insert one so that the sentence follows our grammatical structure. So we have 'In the beginning', even though there is no definite article in the Greek. An example of removing a definite article is also in 'John 1:1'. We simply say 'The Word was with God', and not 'The Word was with the God' as the original Greek states it. We do not generally put a definite article before an individual's name, so 'the God' does not sound right to us. These choices are made so that the sentences fit our language. They do not alter the meaning of the sentence in any way. Can the same be said for the choice to translate the sentence 'a god' as opposed to 'God'? These two options are very different, and so the choice has to be made carefully. In light of the numerous other passages throughout the Bible that confirm the tri-unity, the NIV reading is clearly more accurate. Greek has no indefinite article (e.g. 'a' or 'an'), and so it is up to the translator to work out whether a sentence requires one or not. So just like the way sometimes a definite article is necessary or unnecessary, the only way to find out if an indefinite article is required is by checking the context of the passage. We find that the NWT translators were inconsistent with their rule about missing definite articles in the Greek. In 'John 1:6' the word 'theos' meaning 'God' appears again with no definite article, yet the NWT does not translate it to 'a god'. In 'John 1:18' 'God' again appears without a definite article, but is not translated 'a god' in the NWT. In 'John 1:45' we find that both Nathanael and Jesus have a definite article in Greek, but not in the English, due to our language structure. The NIV would agree with these three choices here, but it would seem that the NWT disagrees with itself on how to treat missing 'the's. Finally we should notice about 'John 1:1' that although our English translations read 'the Word was God', the Greek actually reads 'God was the Word'. The word order has been reversed again because of the grammatical structures of our languages. The Greek phrase put emphasis on the word 'God' by having it appear first in the sentence. (Further examples of this technique are seen in 'James 2:19' ('one God' vs 'God is one'), and 'Philippians 2:11' ('Jesus Christ is Lord' vs 'Lord is Jesus Christ')). In English our emphasis is mainly done by the tone of our voice. The flow of the English sentence feels more natural with 'God' at the end. Colossians 1:15-19 In the NWT this passage reads as follows: "15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. 17 Also, he is before all other things, and by means of him all other things were made to exist, 18 and he is the head of the body, the congregation. He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that he might become the one who is first in all things; 19 because God was pleased to have all fullness to dwell in him" In the NIV the passage has a very different reading: "15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. 19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him" Verse 15 is essentially identical in both versions. Both tell us that Jesus is the image of the invisible God and the firstborn. But even here a slight difference between 'of all creation', and 'over all creation', changes the meaning. The NWT translation favours the idea that Jesus was the first creation, and so 'firstborn of creation' makes sense of that. But 'over all creation' in the NIV reflects the true meaning of the word 'firstborn', which refers to an heir. The clearer differences in the passages are in the following verses. In the NWT Jesus is credited with creating all 'other' things, while the NIV tells us Jesus created all things. Looking at the New Testament in the original Greek shows us that the NIV is a better translation in this case, as no word appears that could possibly be translated to mean 'other'. The word 'other' has been inserted without reason to and changes the meaning dramatically. So while the NIV and the original Greek texts show us that Jesus is the one creator of all, the NWT seems to have altered the verses to suit the preconceived conclusion that Jesus is not God. Who is coming in 'Revelation 1'? There is much debate about who is speaking in 'Revelation 1:8' and therefore directly claiming the titles 'Alpha and Omega' and 'Almighty'. Some Bibles such as the NASB have the speech in red letters, signifying certainty that Jesus is speaking. Other commentaries give reason to believe it is the Father speaking. However, given that in this passage the 'Almighty' is identified as the same being as 'the Alpha and Omega', and that 'the Alpha and Omega' is identified as the same being as 'the first and the last' and that both of these titles are applied to Jesus elsewhere, (Revelation 1:17-18, Revelation 22:12-16), it makes very little difference whether or not it is the Father or the Son speaking in Revelation 1:8. The Tri-unity is shown through these and several other passages, so if the Tri-unity is a true doctrine, either the Father or the Son is the voice of God. Pinning down exactly who is speaking in 'Revelation 1:8' is only a problem for a non-trinitarian. 1 A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent his angel and presented it in signs through him to his slave John, 2 who bore witness to the word God gave and to the witness Jesus Christ gave, yes, to all the things he saw. 3 Happy is the one who reads aloud and those who hear the words of this prophecy and who observe the things written in it, for the appointed time is near. 4 John to the seven congregations that are in the province of Asia: May you have undeserved kindness and peace from “the One who is and who was and who is coming,” and from the seven spirits that are before his throne, 5 and from Jesus Christ, “the Faithful Witness,” “the firstborn from the dead,” and “the Ruler of the kings of the earth.” To him who loves us and who set us free from our sins by means of his own blood— 6 and he made us to be a kingdom, priests to his God and Father—yes, to him be the glory and the might forever. Amen. 7 Look! He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, and those who pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief because of him. Yes, Amen. 8 “I am the Alʹpha and the O·meʹga,” says Jehovah God, “the One who is and who was and who is coming, the Almighty.” Though previously, we have seen that the context of the passage seems to point conclusively to Jesus being the speaker in verse 8, there is one part of the text that makes a compelling case for the Father. When we look at verse 4, we see that John talks of 'the One who is and who was and who is coming', and also of 'Jesus Christ'. So in verse 4, they seem to be separate. Then in verse 8, the one speaking refers to themself as 'the One who is and who was and who is coming'. This would identify them as the being in verse 4 who is separate from Jesus. So the conclusion would seem to suggest that the Father is the speaker in verse 8. For a non-trinitarian, this separation of Father and Son makes sense, and the only being who can rightfully claim the title of the Almighty Alpha and Omega is the Father Jehovah God. But, we must always remember to take the Bible as a whole. We have already seen that Jesus does claim the title of 'Alpha and Omega', and a proper understanding of this title is that there can only be one. So the non-trinitarian reading of Verse 8 is in conflict with other passages of the book of Revelation. So how can a trinitarian make sense of this passage? We notice that the being in verse 4 is referred to as 'the One'. He is not referred to as 'the Father'. The doctrine of the tri-unity is three persons in one being. So this 'One' in verse 4 represents Jehovah as a whole - Father, Son, Holy Spirit. Since his incarnation, Jesus has been both fully man and fully God, and still maintains that form today. because it is in him that all the fullness of divine quality dwells bodily - Colossians 2:9 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man Christ Jesus - 1 Timothy 2:5 When I saw him, I fell as dead at his feet. And he laid his right hand on me and said: "Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last" - Revelation 1:17 In Paul's verses, he writes in present tense after the resurrection of Jesus. He refers to him as a man with a body. John tells us that Jesus 'laid his right hand' on him. So it is clear that after his death, Jesus remained a man, and yet retained full divinity. Given that the 'One' of 'Revelation 1:4' is Jehovah as a whole, and that Jesus is the visible image of the invisible God (Colossians 1:15), it makes sense that 'Revelation 1:8' is Jesus speaking, because he is the personal part of the 'One' that we can communicate with (as seen in 'Exodus 33:11,20'). This makes sense of the full context of verse 8, which seems to clearly indicate both that Jesus and God are speaking. So while God is limitless, invisible, and non-physical in his full glory, his divinity is within the human body of Jesus which is limited, visible, and physical. This is how the man Jesus is the mediator between mankind and God. He is both man and God.
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Bog je JEDAN! Bog je JEDAN! „Bog je JEDAN!” (Galaćanima 3, 20) Jedan je Bog.Samo je JEDAN BOG! Ova doktrina je centralna u Biblijskoj PORUCI zajedno i za Stari i za Novi Zavet. Bez obzira na jednostavnost ove poruke i jasnoću s kojom ju Biblija prezentuje, mnogi koji veruju u Boga i Njegovo postojanje to ne razumeju. Uz te koji se svrstavaju među hrišćane, imamo nekoliko različitih stajališta koja se sukobljuju po pitanju božanstva. Jedan od pogleda, nazvan trinitarijanstvo tvrdi da postoje tri različite osobe u Božanstvu. Bog Otac, Bog Sin, Bog Duh Sveti, a li ipak „jedan Bog.” Izraziti hrišćanski monoteisti veruju u JEDNOGA BOGA, ali i dalje veruju da je punina Božanstva manifestovana (očitovana) u HRISTU. Oni veruju da je Otac, Sin, i Duh Sveti manifestacije, modeli, službe, ili odnosi kako se jedan Bog objavio ljudima. Veruju u nevidljivo jedinstvo Boga i puninu Božanstva Isusa Hrista i često koriste termin „onenes” kako bi opisali svoje verovanje. Klasično objašnjenje doktrine o Jednom Bogu pronalazimo u Ponovljenom Zakonu 6, 4: „Čuj, Izrailju: Gospod je Bog naš jedini Gospod.”Ovaj redak Pisma postao je jako karakteristična i važna stavka za Jevreje. Oni to nazivaju „SHEMA” (ŠEMA), poslije prve reči fraze na Hebrejskom: „Čuj, Izrailju: Gospod je Bog naš jedini Gospod.” Tradicionalno, pobožno Jevreji uvek pokušavaju ovo učiniti ispovedanjem vere pre svoje smrti. PRIRODA BOŽJA „Bog je duh, i koji mu se klanjaju, moraju mu se klanjati u duhu i u istini." (Jovan 4, 24) Naš mali ljudski um ne može istražiti i shvatiti svo to znanje o Bogu, ali Biblija opisuje jako važne karakeristike i atribute koje Bog posjeduje. Bog je Duh. On je nevidljiv osim ako ne izabere da se manifestira u formi vidljivoj ljudima. "Lica mojega ne možeš ugledati; jer ni jedan čovjek ne može me vidjeti i ostati živ." (Izlazak 33, 20) „Boga niko nije vidio nikada.” (Ivan 1, 18; 1. Ivanova 4, 12) „Koji jedini ima besmrtnost i prebiva u svjetlosti, kojoj se ne može pristupiti; kojega nitko od ljudi nije vidio.” (1. Timoteju 6, 16) Ali Bog je svoju prirodu otkrio čovječanstvu naročito kroz vidljive manifestacije. IMENA I TITULE BOŽJE „I nema ni u jednom drugom spasenja; jer nema drugoga imena pod nebom danoga ljudima, u kojem treba da se spasimo." (Djela 4, 12) Čak niti kroz to mi u potpunosti ne možemo shvatiti Boga, Bog koristi više načina da nam pokaže Sebe. Jedna od tih metoda je korišćenje različitih imena i titula da bi otkrio Sebe. „YAHWEH” (Jehova) je otkupiteljsko ime Božje u Starom Zavjetu (Izlazak 6, 3-8.). „Sam Gospod, to je ime moje. Časti svoje ne dajem drugomu, slave svoje ne dajem idolima.“ (Izaija 42:8.). To podrazumeva da postoji Samo-postojeći Jedan ili Jedino Večni Bog. Ovaj koncept javlja se u frazama „Ja sam Onaj koji Jesam!” „JA SAM” korištenih od Boga osobno. U Starom Zavjetu, Bog postupno više otkriva Sebe u potrebama u životima ljudi, i On koristi imena da bi izrazio se otkrivajući Sebe. Kada je Avraam trebao jagnje za žrtvu, Bog je Sebe otkrio kao JAHVE JIRAH, Bog koji proviđa. Kada je Izrael trebao oslobođenje, Bog se otkrio u imenu JAHVE prethodno nepoznatim značenjem sa poštovanjem za oslobođenje i spasenje. Kada je Izrael trebao zaštitu od bolesti i tegoba, Bog se otkrio kao JAHVE-RAPHA, Bog koji ozdravlja. Kada je Izrael trebao pobjedu nad neprijateljima, Bog je otkrio Sebe kao JAHVE-NISSI, Bog naša Zastava. Ova imena i titule opisuju skupa sva očitovanja važnih aspekata o prirodi Božjoj. Kada je došla punina vremena Bog je želio objaviti se Njegovom narodu i Sebe otkriti u svoj Njegovoj moći i slavi kroz IME ISUS. Isus znači JAHVE SPASITELJ, JAVE NAŠE SPASENJE ili Jahve je SPASENJE. I zato anđeo kaže: „Ona će roditi sina, kojemu ćeš nadjenuti ime Isus; jer će on izbaviti narod svoj od grijeha njegovih." (Matej 1, 21) ISUS JE BOG „Jer u njemu stanuje sva punina Božanstva tjelesno.” (Kološanima 2, 9) Činjenica da je Isus Bog čvrsto je utemeljena na Pismu kao činjenica da je JEDAN BOG. Biblijsko učenje da Isus je potpuno Bog i potpuno čovjek. Isaija 9, 6 je jedan od najmoćnijih dokaza da je ISUS BOG: „Jer nam se rodi dijete, sin nam se dade. Vlast počiva na plećima njegovim, 'čudo od savjetnika' glasi ime njegovo, 'Jaki Bog, 'Otac vječni', 'Knez mira'.” Izrazi dijete i sin ukazuju na utjelovljenje, ili na manifestaciju „moćnoga Boga!” a „Oca Vječnoga!” Novi Zavjet također ispovijeda da je ISUS BOG. Toma je ispovedio Isusu obadvoje: GOSPOD I BOG (Jovan 20, 28.) Prema Delima 22, 28, crkva je otkupljena sa Božjom vlastitom krvlju, zapravo HRISTOVOM KRVLJU. Pavle Isusa opisuje kao „našega velikoga Boga i Spasitelja, Isusa Hrista.” (Titu 2, 13,) BOG SE MANIFESTOVAO U TELU Činjenica da je Isus Bog nužno podrazumijeva da je Bog uzeo ljudsko telo. To je činjenica o kojoj Biblija kaže: „I kao što je priznato, velika je tajna pobožnosti: On se javio u tijelu, opravdao se u Duhu, pokazao se anđelima, propovijedao se neznabošcima, vjerovao se u svijetu, uznio se u slavi.” (1. Timoteju 3, 16) Jovan 1, 1-15 predivno uči koncept Božjeg manifestovanja u telu. U početku bijaše RIJEČ (LOGOS). Riječ nije posebna osoba ili odijeljeni Bog ništa više nego što je ljudska reč odvojena osoba od čoveka. Pre je Reč bila planirana u Božjim mislima. „U početku bijaše Riječ, i Riječ, bijaše u Boga, i Bog bijaše Riječ.” (Jovan 1, 1) Utelovljenje (inkarnacija) je postojala u naumu Božjem pre postanka sveta. U naumu Božjem Jagnje je ubijeno pre utemeljenja sveta (1. Petrova 1, 19-20; Otktivenje 13,8.). OTAC, SIN, DUH SVETI „Ja i Otac smo JEDNO.” (Jovan 10, 30) ”Ja ću moliti Oca i On će vam dati drugoga Tješitelja... Duha ISTINE!” (Jovan 14, 16-17). Da li termini Otac, Sin i Duh Sveti označavaju tri različite osobe ili osobnosti u Božanstvu? Ili pak oni otkrivaju tri različite uloge, modela, funkcije, ili službe kroz koje Jedan Bog deluje i otkriva sebe? Bog je Otac, On nije samo Otac Sinu već Otac svemu stvorenju (Malahija 2, 10; Jevrejima 12, 9). Isus naučava puno puta da je Bog naš Otac (Matej 5,16, 45, 48). Učio nas je moliti: ”Oče naš koji jesi na Nebesima.” (Matej 6, 9). Termin „Sin Božji” odnosi se na Boga kao manifestovanog u telu u osobi Isusa Hrista za spasenje čovečanstva. Ime Sina je ISUS: „Ona će roditi sina, kojemu ćeš nadjenuti ime ISUS." (Matej 1, 21). „Otac” se odnosi samo na Božanstvo kao utjelovljenje u čovečanstvu. Jovan 14, 10 kaže nam da je Otac u Sinu. Ako je Duh Sveti jednostavno Bog, zašto je potreban ovaj termin? Razlog zašto se naglašava osobni aspekt Božji. Naglašava da je On svet, sveprisutan, i nevidljivi Duh koji radi među svim ljudima posvuda i koji može ispuniti ljudima srca. Kada govorimo o Svetome Duhu, mi se podsećamo na Božje nevidljivo delovanje među ljudima i Njegove sposobnosti da pomazuje, krsti, ispunjava, i prebiva u ljudskim životima. ZAKLJUČAK Pa šta možemo reći o Bogu? Prvo, tamo je Jedan nevidljivi Bog koji ne postoji u više različitih osoba. Drugo, Isus Hrist je punina Božjeg utelovljenja. On je Bog Otac – Jahve u Starom Zavetu- manifestovan u telu. SAV BOG je u ISUSU HRISTU, i u Njemu imamo sve što nam je potrebno. JEDINI BOG kojeg ćemo u Nebu videti je ISUS HRIST. Poslednji put izmenio SION dana 2015-01-20, 15:53, izmenio ukupno 5 puta Re: Bog je JEDAN! On se naziva Sin Božji, jer je začet u utrobi Marije. Bog nikada nije smislio drugi duh. Bog nije osmislio Večnoga Sina. Sinovstvo je proizišlo iz začeća i nije večno. Sin samo može biti rođen NAKON što je žena zatrudnela. Bog nikada nije dao začeće nekoj ženi pre Marije. Bog nikada nije imao sina pre Marijinog začeća osim Isusa Hrista. To dete je Božji jedinorođeni Sin. Sada je Isus večan - što će reći da je " Njegova punina vlasti, mir nema nikada kraja.", Isaija 9:07. Ali Sin Božji nije postojao dok nije začet ljudski i telesno u utrobi Marije. Pre je Isus bio zamišljen kao čovek, Bog je bestelesan. Bog je SAMO DUH. JEDAN nepodeljen Duh. Samo Bog rodio je jedno dete u svoj večnosti. To je razlog zašto je Isus učio, u Jovanu 3:16, da je on "jedinorođeni Sin."Isus je bio rođen - začet - kada je Duh Sveti zasjenio Mariju. Ona je začela čoveka - dete u svojoj utrobi. Duh Sveti zasenio je Mariju i začet je Isus. To čini Duh Sveti- Otac Isusa. Duh Sveti nije treća osoba zamišljenog Trojstva. To ima smisla (da je Duh Sveti i Otac). Obratite pažnju na ove izjave: Bog Otac je Duh. Duh Sveti je Duh. Bog je samo jedan duh. Bog Otac je Sveti. Sveti Duh je Sveti. Obe tvrdnje su da je Otac Isusa Hrista. Stoga .. Otac je Duh Sveti. Duh Sveti je Otac. Otac nije prva osoba Trojstva. Duh Sveti nije treća osoba Trojstva. Otac je Duh Sveti. Isus je telesno punina Božja. Duh prebiva u njemu. Kada napokon stanemo pred prestolje Božje na nebu, videćemo samo jedno prestolje sa samo jednom osobom koja sedi na tom prestolju. Da, Jedna osoba će biti tamo i ta osoba će biti i Bog Otac i JAGNJE istodobno. Jovan je rekao: "Evo, prijestolje je postavljeno na nebu, a JEDAN je sjedio na prijestolju," Otkrivenje 04:02. Jovan ga naziva, "prijestolje Božje i Jaganjetovo", Otkrivenje 22:01. Bog i Jaganjac su jedan, sedi na prestolju JEDAN. Ako vidite Isusa, videćete Jagnje, ali i ćete videti Boga. Punina Božja jeste u Hristu. Isus je rekao: "Ja i moj Otac smo jedno," (Ivan 10:30). On je takođe rekao: "Onaj koji je vidio mene vidio je i Oca" (Ivan 14:09). Je li Isus doista znači da je on i Otac su bili ista osoba? Ili je on samo znači nešto apstraktno poput: "Ja i moj Otac izgledamo vrlo slično"? Ili je on samo, "Ja i moj Otac smo jednojajčani blizanci"? Ili je on samo, "Ja sam klon od Oca"? Ili je On, "Ja sam pljunuta slika Oca"? Ne morate pogađati. Pavle je odgovorio da je, rekavši da je Isus "slika Boga nevidljivoga", Kološanima 1:15. Napomena: Apostol Pavle je učio nauku Jedinstva Boga! Bog ima samo jednu sliku: Isusa Hrista! Bog ima samo jedno telo: Isusa Hrista! Bog je nevidljivi Duh. Njegovo jedino telo je Isus. Zapamtite, Mojsije je rekao da Jahve je jedan. On će uvek biti jedan. On nikada neće biti dva ili tri. Bog će uvek biti samo jedan Gospod. Opet i opet, Bog naglašava izjavljujući da on je jedini - SAM. " Ovako veli Gospodin, otkupitelj tvoj, tvorac tvoj od krila materina: "Ja sam Gospod, stvoritelj svega, koji sam razapeo nebo, sam raspostro zemlju, - tko mi je pomogao?” Isaija 44:24. " Ne bojte se i ne plašite se! Nijesam li ja to davno rekao i objavio, vi ste mi svjedoci: ima li bog osim mene? Ne, nema drugoga boga. Ne znam nijednoga.," Isaija 44:8. "Ja sam prvi i ja sam posljednji: osim mene Boga nema," Isaija 44:6. Nema množine u tim izjavama, nema više osoba. Ako želite videti tačno kako je Bog izgledao u večnosti kroz prošlost, POGLEDAJTE unatrag u večnost da biste videli tu izvornu formu. Uklonite sve što je Bog ikada stvorio, sve dok ništa ne ostane osim Boga. Uklonite čovečanstvo. Uklonite svaku zver, pticu i morska stvorenja, svaku biljku, stablo i cvet. Uklonite zemlju i njen nebeski svod. Uklonite Sunce, Mesec i sve zvezde. Uklonite prestolje Božje. (David reče u psalama 103:19, "Jahve je pripremio svoje prijestolje na nebesima." (Čak i prijestolje je stvorio.) Uklonite grad nebeski. Njegov "graditelj i tvorac Bog", Hebrejima 11:10. Uklonite sve anđela i demone. Oni su svi bili stvoreni od Boga. SADA: Pogledajte u BESKONAČNOG u tami večne prošlosti. Koji oblik vidiš? Kako to Bog izgleda? Vidiš li neka tri čoveka kako hodaju uokolo u svemiru? Apsolutno ne! Vidite li tri bića, druženje i razgovor? Apsolutno ne! Samo ćete naći jedan Duh koji nastanjuje sve u svemu. JEDAN BOG. JEDAN Jahve. Nevidljivi. Nedjeljiv. Bog.Otac.Duh Sveti. U tom trenutku, nije bilo Sina. Sin ne bi došao u postojanje do 4000 godine u prošlo vreme . Isus je potvrdio činjenicu da je Bog nevidljiv. On je rekao farisejima: " Ali glasa njegova niti ste kad čuli, ni lica njegova nijeste vidjeli;," Jovan 5:37. Vi nikada niste vidjeli Njegov oblik. Bog nema oblik! Jovan naglašava: "Nijedan čovjek nikada nije vidio Boga u bilo kojem trenutku," Jovan 1:18. Isus Hrist je bio samo utelovljenje Boga! "Riječ je tijelom postala i nastanila se među nama" Jovan 1:14. "Ko je vidio Mene vidio je i Oca." Filip je pitao Isusa da "nam pokaže Oca." Isus je odgovorio: "Nisam bio tako dugo s vama i još me ne znaš, Filipa? Onaj koji je vidio mene vidio je i Oca" Jovan 14:8-9. ISUS "Njegovo [Božja] telo, punina Onoga koji ispunjava sve u svemu," Efežanima 1:23. Jovan 1:10 nam govori da je "On je bio u svijetu, i svijet po njemu, a svijet ga ne upozna." Jevreji su odbili da veruju da je njihov otac bio u telu Hristovu. No, on je bio u Hristu. "Bog je u Hristu" "Naime, da Bog je u Kristu pomirio svijet sa sobom", 2.Korinćanima 5:19. Pavle opisuje tu misteriju Timoteju: "Bog je bio očitovan u tijelu," Timoteju 3:16. "Punina božanstva Tjelesna" "U Njemu prebiva sva punina božanstva [Božanstvo] tjelesno", Kološanima 2:09. "Došao je k svojima, a Njegova ga ne primiše", Jovan 1:11. Nevidljivi Bog iznenada pojavio, a oni nisu znali ko je On zapravo! Isaija je prorekao da će njegovo ime biti "Emanuel", što znači "Bog s nama", Isaija 7:14, Matej 1:23. "Slika Boga nevidljivoga" Pavle je učio u korintskoj crkvi da je Hrist "slika Boga", 2. Korinćanima 4:4. On je učio kološansku Crkvu da je Sin "slika Boga nevidljivoga", Kološanima 1:15. "Jer se je dopalo Bogu (Otac), da u njemu stanuje sva punina Božanstva (Otac u Njemu)", Kološanima 1:19. To je razlog zašto je Ivan rekao: "Riječ je tijelom postala." Isus Krist je Jahve Spasitelj koji je došao u telu. U stvari, vrlo je jasno značenje imena "Isus" koje je: "Gospod Spasitelj."Isus je objasnio, "Ja sam došao u ime Oca svoga" Jovan 5:43. Isus nije klon Boga Oca. On nije duplikat božanstva. On nije ”Jehova Mlađi.” On nije su-jednak ili su-večan s Ocem. On nije druga osoba od tri osobe koje postoje. Isus je Otac (večni Duh) očitovan u Sinu (čoveku-telu)! Isus, govoreći kao ČOVEK insistirao da on nije bio jednak s Ocem kad je rekao: "Moj Otac je veći od mene", u I. Otac je veći od Sina! Bog je večni Duh. Sin je čovek rođen od Marije. Isus je to rekao. Otac je rekao, u Isaiji 42:8, "Moju Slava neću dati drugome." Otac i Sin NISU su-jednaki ili su-večni kao što to tvrdi doktrina Trojstva. Isus Hrist nije drugi član božanstva. Isus je čovek u kome prebiva Otac. Jedinstvo Boga je večni nauk od Boga, to je doktrina koja se veruje i propovedala svima u ranoj Crkvi. Doktrina Jedinstva Boga (eng. Oneness) kaže da je večni, nevidljivi Duh (Otac) objavio se u ljudskom telu - Hristovu. Bog je u Hristu. Bog Otac nikada nije izumeo ili stvorio "Boga Sina." To je bogohuljenje, krivoveran pogrešan naziv. Fraza "Bog Sin" nikada se ne pojavljuje u Bibliji. Sin Božji je "rođen od žene" (ne u večnosti, ne u prošlosti) kako kaže Galaćanima 4:4, a "to što je u njoj začeto (govori anđeo Josipu) od Duha je Svetoga", Matej 1:20. U Luki 1:35, "Anđeo odgovori i reče joj, Duh Sveti sići će na te i sila će te Svevišnjega zasjeniti: Zato će se to sveto što je od tebe rođeno zvati Sin Božji.""Začet od Duha Svetoga" znači "Duh Sveti je Otac." U Mateju 01:20, Anđeo je rekao Josipu: "Josipe, sine Davidov, ne boj se uzeti k sebi Mariju, ženu svoju; jer što se je začelo u njoj, od Duha je Svetoga."To nam jasno pokazuje da Duh Sveti je zapravo Otac, jer Ivan je rekao Sin Čovječji "Jedinorođenac od Oca",Jovan 1:14. Ljudsko tijelo Isusovo nije samo začeto od (njegova) Duha Svetoga - Oca, ali je takođe vidljiva ljuska u kojoj je zapravo smešten Otac. Ako Duh Sveti je treća osoba Trojstva, onda prva osoba Trojstva nije otac! Apsolutno je nemoguće pomiriti ove biblijske stihove osim doktrine Jedinstva Boga (oneness) koju naučavamo. Nadalje, ako je Bog Trojstvo tj. tri osobe, a ako je Isus punina božanstva TELESNO, tu međutim imamo tri osobe u Isusovom telu! Naravno, to je apsurd! Isus je punina Boga telesno jer OTAC (Sveti Duh) prebiva u Njemu. Bog nije tri osobe. Bog Gospodin naš je jedan Gospodin. On je JEDAN DUH. To je Duh Oca, koji se je utjelovio u telo Isusa. Punina Boga je Otac i On je u telu Isusa. Svi propovednici u prvom stoleću Crkve razumeli su ko je Isus bio i šta je tvrdio da je. Shvatili su da je Isus tvrdio da je On Bog utelovljen.Shvatili su da je Isus tvrdio da je Bog Otac s neba sišao u telu čoveka. Poslednji izmenio SION dana 2014-08-16, 01:35, izmenjeno ukupno 1 puta Re: Bog je JEDAN! Doista zanimljivo. Re: Bog je JEDAN! A pa ovo je Dragančetov tekst. Re: Bog je JEDAN! Ako je Isusovo carstvo VEČNO kako onda On prestaje biti CAR po učenju nekih? Oni uzimaju ovaj stih kao dokaz: 15:24 Onda kraj, kad preda carstvo Bogu i Ocu, i kad ukine svako poglavarstvo i svaku vlast i silu. 15:25 Jer Njemu valja carovati dokle ne položi sve neprijatelje svoje pod noge svoje. 15:26 A poslednji će se neprijatelj ukinuti, smrt. 15:27 Jer sve pokori pod noge Njegove. Ali kad veli da je sve Njemu pokoreno, pokazuje se da je osim Onog koji Mu pokori sve. 15:28 A kad Mu sve pokori, onda će se i sam Sin pokoriti Onom koji Mu sve pokori, da bude Bog sve u svemu. Hajdemo ovaj stih provući kroz Biblijske poruke da vidimo o čemu je reč. 15:24 Onda kraj, kad preda carstvo Bogu i Ocu, i kad ukine svako poglavarstvo i svaku vlast i silu. Čujemo da Isus kao spasitelj predaje nekome CARSTVO ali prvo mora UKINUTI nešto a to je POGLAVARSTVA,VLASTI i SILE. U drugom dolasku koji očekujemo Isus će ratovati i uzeti svete i sići da CARUJE tu TEK počinje carovanje i ne ukida ništa jer satana i dalje je živ i živeće mnoštvo grešnika van granica svete zemlje. 15:25 Jer Njemu valja carovati dokle ne položi sve neprijatelje svoje pod noge svoje. Znači u milenijumu POČINJE CARSTVO i traje 1000 godina a da li prestaje čućemo. Tek kad SVE neprijatelje stavi pod noge (budu prah ili u jezeru) onda je prestanak takve vrste carstva sa tom službom. Mi čitamo da je posle milenijuma pušten satana i da mnoštvo neprijatelja želi rat, dakle ni tad još nije sve to ispunjeno. 15:26 A poslednji će se neprijatelj ukinuti, smrt. Čitamo da posle milenijuma ide sukob i onda SUD a posle suda ukida se smrt i od tad više NEMA NEPRIJATELJA, ko nema neprijatelja od tad? Nema Isus kao TELO i CAR U TELU a nemaju ni sveti Njegovi. Čujmo sad pažljivo: 15:27 Jer sve pokori pod noge Njegove. Ali kad veli da je sve Njemu pokoreno, pokazuje se da je osim Onog koji Mu pokori sve. 15:28 A kad Mu sve pokori, onda će se i sam Sin pokoriti Onom koji Mu sve pokori, da bude Bog sve u svemu. Ovo zahteva koncentraciju,Ko SVE pokorava pod čije noge? Isus U TELU treba ukinuti svako poglavarstvo i silu i vlast jer TELO to može učiniti isto kao što je trebalo doći da OTKUPI sad dolazi da CARUJE a potom to TELO ima zadnju službu a to je ZATIRANJA svih neprijatelja. Kome TELO to priprema čist put? Onome koji je DUH i po kojem TELO dođe u Mariju i na svet. Ali ponovo želim da pazite na dvojnu obrnutost rečenica sa značenjem pišite i polako čitajte ove redove: 15:24 Onda kraj, kad preda carstvo Bogu i Ocu, i kad ukine svako poglavarstvo i svaku vlast i silu. 15:25 Jer Njemu valja carovati dokle ne položi sve neprijatelje svoje pod noge svoje. 15:26 A poslednji će se neprijatelj ukinuti, smrt. 15:27 Jer sve pokori pod noge Njegove. Ali kad veli da je sve Njemu pokoreno, pokazuje se da je osim Onog koji Mu pokori sve. 15:28 A kad Mu sve pokori, onda će se i sam Sin pokoriti Onom koji Mu sve pokori, da bude Bog sve u svemu. Re: Bog je JEDAN! Da li ste zbunjeni? Imamo li kontradikcije u Biblijskom izveštaju? NEMA. Izjava da je Isusovo carstvo večno i da ima presto i da vlada stoji i ne prestaje. A šta zapravo prestaje? Hajde da ne pišem odma da do toga zajedno dođemo. Ovakve stvari inače zadržavam za crkvu gde<se detaljno sve radi ali evo ovaj deo želim podeliti i sa vama. Molim vas ponovo pratite i naglas govorite redom ko kome ravna put-priprema teren da preda carstvo pa napišite vaš zaključak biće mi drago da zajedno čujemo šta ČUJEMO. Re: Bog je JEDAN! SION :: A pa ovo je Dragančetov tekst. Meni se sviđa onaj deo što pravi paralelu zato ga i zalepih mada imam svoje ali neka bude iz više izvora. Ono ispod paralela mi nije dobro ali neću više da vadim iz tekstova šta je po meni ispravno već nudim celinu a zato ću reći dokle je dobro. Re: Bog je JEDAN! Jep ЊeMy Baљa цapoBaTи дokлe He пoлoжи cBe HeпpиjaTeљe cBoje пoд Hore cBoje. A пocлeдњи ћe ce HeпpиjaTeљ ykиHyTи, cMpT. Jep cBe пokopи пoд Hore ЊeroBe. Aли kaд Beли дa je cBe ЊeMy пokopeHo, пokaзyje ce дa je ocиM OHor kojи My пokopи cBe. A kaд My cBe пokopи, oHдa ћe ce и caM CиH пokopиTи OHoM kojи My cBe пokopи, дa бyдe Бor cBe y cBeMy. Mislim da znate šta želim reći,to je ta zanimljivost koja obično promakne ako se čita a ne sluša. Evo kako ja to ČUJEM: Isus ukida svako poglavarstvo i silu i vlast ali tekl posle milenijuma i suda. A kako O to može ukinuti kad to Otac treba da čini? Ko je sudija svoj zemlji? Piše Bog a čitamo da će Isus suditi. A onda kaže: Jep cBe пokopи пoд Hore ЊeroBe. Aли kaд Beли дa je cBe ЊeMy пokopeHo, пokaзyje ce дa je ocиM OHor kojи My пokopи cBe. A kaд My cBe пokopи, oHдa ћe ce и caM CиH пokopиTи OHoM kojи My cBe пokopи, дa бyдe Бor cBe y cBeMy. Isus pokorava sve pod noge Božje i kad sve ISUS POKORI ali Isus nije pod nogama onog kome sve pokori da bi u sledećem stiglo kako i Isus biva pokoren Bogu koji Isusu sve pokori da bude Bog sve u svemu. Ko zapravo tu pokorava kome pod noge sve? Re: Bog je JEDAN! Tako će se Bog konačno u celosti i sili i slavi moći pokazati. Ne više kao stradalno telo i ne više kao ratnik već kao silni Stvoritelj i večni car svega. To je moje verovanje i razumevanje ove teme. Re: Bog je JEDAN! lavić ::Ko zapravo tu pokorava kome pod noge sve? Pitaj Kainosa. Re: Bog je JEDAN! Kojи ce roд oдpичe CиHa Hи Oцa HeMa; a kojи пpизHaje CиHa, и Oцa иMa. Ko odriče ISUSA taj je laža. Znači, neko može reći da veruje u Boga ali Isusa da ne priznaje kao Božjeg Sina taj je lažac ali tu nije kraj komentara o takvima pa kaže dalje: Ko odriče SINA taj nema BOGA....kako, pa oni Boga veruju samo Isusa kao Sina ne priznaju šta im to smeta?Nisu oni Boga odrekli već SAMO Sina....a onda kaže da onaj ko nema Sina taj nema Boga kao Oca....zašto? Zato što se kako apostol reče SVA PUNINA Božja javi kroz TELO i to je velika tajna pobožnosti.Može tvrditi da ima Oca ako nema Sina nema ni Oca jer se Otac kroz SINA objavio i zato reče da je Sin = Otac večni i Bog silni. Taj Sim reče ko vidi Njega taj vidi Oca. Taj Sin kaže da su On i Otac jedno, ne zajedno već jedno-jednina a to znači ne dvojica ili trojica. Može Bog imati više titula kao Otac, Sin,Duh Sveti ali je uvek On jedan isti.Isaija najavljuje da će za glasom koji viče u pustinji stići BOG i stigao je. Jovan kaže da je Bog bio REČ i ta reč postade TELOM a koje to telo posta rečju i pokaza sebe kao Oca učenicima? Re: Bog je JEDAN! lavić :: Zato što se kako apostol reče SVA PUNINA Božja javi kroz TELO i to je velika tajna pobožnosti.Može tvrditi da ima Oca ako nema Sina nema ni Oca jer se Otac kroz SINA objavio i zato reče da je Sin = Otac večni i Bog silni. Taj Sim reče ko vidi Njega taj vidi Oca. Taj Sin kaže da su On i Otac jedno, ne zajedno već jedno-jednina a to znači ne dvojica ili trojica. Može Bog imati više titula kao Otac, Sin,Duh Sveti ali je uvek On jedan isti.Isaija najavljuje da će za glasom koji viče u pustinji stići BOG i stigao je. Jovan kaže da je Bog bio REČ i ta reč postade TELOM a koje to telo posta rečju i pokaza sebe kao Oca učenicima? Ne mogu ljudi to shvatiti jer su te titule proglasili nekim ličnostima i osobama i neće da čuju da je Bog postao telo koje se naziva ISUS HRIST Sin Božiji ALI i Čovečiji! Dakle sva punina Božanstva telesno, a ne polovina ili trećina! Re: Bog je JEDAN! Kako je Otac SIN i Sin Otac i kako se Duh kroz telo pokazao i kako videvši obličje čoveka videše Boga...zašto nema drugog IMENA i zašto se krsti u IME Isusa.Itd. itd. Re: Bog je JEDAN! lavić ::Nema Kainosa....mislio sam da ima pitanja u vezi toga ko je Bog i ko se kome moli i sl. možda ga prošlo pa ga ne interesuje više kako se Bog mogao javiti u telu i istovremeno biti izvan tela. Kako je Otac SIN i Sin Otac i kako se Duh kroz telo pokazao i kako videvši obličje čoveka videše Boga...zašto nema drugog IMENA i zašto se krsti u IME Isusa.Itd. itd. Nema ni Tripa koji reče da je Isus YHWH, ali nije Otac. Re: Bog je JEDAN! Kor 8. 6 _ Ali mi imao samo jednog Boga Oca od kojega je sve i jednog Gospoda Isusa Krista kroz koga je sve....nemojte ljude uvjeravati u Sabelijevu doktrinu kad svako razuman ce vam reci da u ovom stihu vidimo dvije osobe...ne samo u ovom nego u stotinu drugih.... kainos - Broj poruka : 35 Datum upisa : 05.12.2013 Re: Bog je JEDAN! kainos ::Evo kainosa...kainos kao iskusni menadzer foruma izaija95.lollb.com radi na povecanju clanstva na svom forumu...ovdje pisem da pomognem SIONU jer ja volim klasicne forume a vecina otisla da raspravlja na facebook... Zašto si osnivao novi forum kad si na izaija95.lollb.com imao veliki broj članova? kainos :: vidim da je SION isto dobar menadzer i da je dovukao dosta ljudi samo sto ne pisu... Ne možeš ih puškom naterati da pišu.. kainos :: Kor 8. 6 _ Ali mi imao samo jednog Boga Oca od kojega je sve i jednog Gospoda Isusa Krista kroz koga je sve.... Ovde piše JEDNOG Oca i JEDNOG Isusa Hrista od koga i kroz koga je sve. Jesu li dvojica stvarala sve ili jedan? kainos ::nemojte ljude uvjeravati u Sabelijevu doktrinu Iskreno ne znam ko je to niti znam tu doktrinu. Re: Bog je JEDAN! Price 30. 4 kazu da su obojica stvarali... kainos - Broj poruka : 35 Datum upisa : 05.12.2013 Re: Bog je JEDAN! kainos ::Pa forum izaija95 je dobro radio a ja kao admin sam imao obaveza i nisam mogao sve to pratiti....i onda pojavom facebooka forumi pocinju propdati...pa onda sam otvorio novi pa je dobro radio i onda ih prebacio na ovaj zadnji pa je isto dobro radio...onda kad nisam bio aktivan malo je opao kad se posvetim opet proradim..trazim clanove kao i ti na svim stranama facebooku i tako.... Price 30. 4 kazu da su obojica stvarali... Znaš da piše na mnogo mesta da je JEDAN stvarao i voleo bih čuti koja to DVOJICA stvaraju reci im IMENA? Možeš li mi pomoći oko onoga što Jovan reče kao bio Bog i iz Boga izlazi kao neka REČ i ta REČ postaje TELOM, da li je to Bog umnožio-reprodukovao ili je došao U TELU? Ako se reprodukovao onda si u pravu ima ih više a ako nije onda je ostao JEDAN kako i reče, a taj jedan stigao za glasom koji viče poravnite staze BOGU NAŠEM (nisu znali da ima više Bogova pa jedninu koristili) i pitaju Boga pokaži nam OCA i On kaže TOLIKO SAM SA VAMA I JOŠ ME NE ZNATE znaju li ga danas svi? I nastavlja OD SAD I POZNAJETE GA I VIDESTE GA kojeg su to Boga videli što im ga Isus pokaza? Koji to Bog dođe za glasom koji viče PORAVNITE STAZE BOGU NAŠEM? koji je to Bog što se zove OTAC VEČNI, BOG SILNI (tu je samo jedan-šteta nije poveo i onu dvojicu). Pavle je kriv, on reče kako se BOG umesto BOGOVI javio U TELU umesto U TELIMA i tako zaveo ljude na JEDNOG BOGA i JEDNO IME. Šta je Arije učio možemo li o tome? Re: Bog je JEDAN! Može stotinu katolika doći i pisati o pretvaranju hleba u telo i prinositi hleb kao žrtvu i nuditi kipove i ikone i koja korist? Može stotinu Branhamovaca nuditi polni odnos satane sa Adamom i Evom kao znak drveta spoznanja i koja korist? Može stotine Js doći i pisati kako nema darova Duha i kako je Isus prvo stvorenje a Duh energija i koja korist? Može doći stotinu satanista i nuditi truglove-piramide i zrake sunca i slobodu od Božje reči i koja korist? Bog podržava onog što podržava Božju reč i svedoči za istu a sve ostalo vetar odnosi i nestaje jer je slama i pljeva. Sponsored content » IVF i astrologija » jedan astrolog mi je rekao da cu preci u lezbejke?? molim vas , da li je tako nesto moguce?? » uporedni horoskop » 2. i 3. kolo obelezila tri velika derbija i jedan sraman dogadjaj!