<p>Both <code>你爸爸忙吗?</code> and <code>你的爸爸忙吗?</code> are possible. Perhaps because of high degree of collocation that <code>的</code> gets elided. In Chinese it is usually possible to express something similar to a genitive without <code>的</code> in between. I think instead of two nouns in a genitive relation, it becomes a single compound noun instead. Semantically equivalent but the grammatical make up behind it is slightly different.</p>

<p>Consider:</p>

<blockquote>
  <p>我的国家 > 我国</p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T16:12:50.117Z
I think 我的国家 is more emotional and usually used in written chinese or you make a speech.
Alex Chen
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T12:50:44.923Z
2011-12-14T12:50:44.923Z
Flaw
<p>I think the omitting of "的" of possessives in object of a sentence is done by
following situations:</p>

<ul>
<li>a person have some  relationship with preceding person</li>
<li>or just some place after a movement "去、来、上、下、到"  </li>
<li>or some words preceding by attribute "这，那"</li>
</ul>

<p>e.g.</p>

<blockquote>
  <ul>
  <li>places: "去你家","来我国","去他办公室","去他车上","到我这里" </li>
  <li>relationships: "问她爸","找他小孩"，”看望他奶奶“ </li>
  <li>attribute: "坐他那车", "用我这笔"</li>
  </ul>
  
  <p>and add "的" if followed by other things "坐他的车", "找她的笔", "用你的电脑", "讲他的笑话".</p>
  
  <p>and more. you can omit the one if it's still the attribute  of following words. "坐他(的)车的后座", "用你(的)电脑的主机", "找她(的)钢笔的套子"</p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T23:26:21.583Z
May I make a suggestion here. While I find this is a good answer, I think it'd be helpful to those that are learning the language if you could provide English translation for any Chinese examples given in your answer.
Georgeee
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T17:05:06.457Z
2011-12-14T20:00:02.283Z
2011-12-14T20:00:02.283Z
Ryk
<p>Since you are asking "exception in the use of 的", just thought worth mentioning other meanings of <code>的</code> here.</p>

<ul>
<li><p>的(dí) means indeed. For example: <code>的确</code></p></li>
<li><p>的(dì) means object/aim/target/goal. For example: <code>目的</code></p></li>
</ul>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-16T10:27:06.570Z
2011-12-16T10:27:06.570Z
StarCub
<p>When 的 is used for possession or 's, it is often omitted in speaking when it's the subject of a sentence.
For example:</p>

<p>她(的)家很漂亮/她(的)家很漂亮 = Her house/home is beautiful.<br />
你(的)電腦很慢/你(的)电脑很慢 = Your computer is really slow.<br />
他(的)新車很貴/他(的)新车很贵 = His new car is quite expensive.<br /></p>

<p>But 的 is usually kept when it's the object of a sentence.</p>

<p>我喜歡他的車/我喜欢他的车 = I like his car.</p>

<p>But then, again as in any language, there is always exceptions :(</p>

<p>For example:
我去過他(的)家/我去过他(的)家 = I've been to his house.</p>

<p>And because of this omission, interesting sentences like this one can come up occasionally in daily conversation:</p>

<p>他媽的洋裝很高雅/他妈的洋装很高雅 = His mother's dress is very elegant.</p>

<p>If you say this out loud, most Chinese people would pick up "他媽的" (damn, sh*t, bloody, f*cking depending on context) and think you are cursing for a split second before you finish the sentence. While this is not a serious problem in casual conversation, one way to avoid this awkward confusion is to explicitly say "他媽媽的".</p>

<blockquote>
  <p>Added simplified Chinese after the original examples in Traditional Chinese as requested.</p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T16:09:43.503Z
actually, 他妈妈的 is almost the same meaning with 他妈的, oops ...
Alex Chen
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T16:14:32.993Z
Interesting, I've never come across the usage of 他媽媽的 in offensive/cursing manner. Having said that, if one says "他媽媽的洋裝", it'd be less likely to be taken as offensive when the words come out of your mouth.
Georgeee
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T16:19:26.900Z
It depends on the tongue and context. If you say 他妈的洋装 and people talked to feel offensive, then your change to say 他妈妈的洋装 won't help you out of the embarrassment.
Alex Chen
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T20:29:24.950Z
Thanks, nice answer... Are you using Traditional characters?
Alenanno
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T22:51:54.870Z
@Alenanno Yes, I use Traditional characters (^_^) Feel free to drop me a line if you need any help with it.
Georgeee
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-15T10:51:23.540Z
@Georgeee If possible can you write also the simplified version of the first examples you wrote? Don't delete the traditional though, I want to see them both so I can see the differences.
Alenanno
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-16T10:19:15.263Z
@Alenanno simplified chinese added as requested ;) You can find many Traditional to Simplified converters on the web too :)
Georgeee
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-16T10:50:55.413Z
@Georgeee Very kind! Thanks! I see... Well, for now I'm a student of Mandarin, but learning some Traditional on the way won't harm... :D
Alenanno
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-16T11:00:52.437Z
@Alenanno no problem at all ;) I just love the beautiful intricacy of Traditional characters and I find it easier to learn simplified ones coming from a Traditional background.
Georgeee
CC BY-SA 3.0
2011-12-14T12:51:59.957Z
2011-12-16T10:16:38.573Z
2011-12-16T10:16:38.573Z
Georgeee
<p>I know that, when expressing possessives, we add 的 to the usual personal pronouns, such as 我的.</p>

<p>However, in a question in my grammar textbook I saw:</p>

<blockquote>
  <p>你爸爸忙吗? = Is your father busy?</p>
</blockquote>

<p>Why not "你<strong>的</strong>爸爸忙吗？"?</p>

<p>Are there any other exceptional or particular uses of 的 that are worth being mentioned here?</p>

<mandarin><possessives>
Is this an exception in the use of 的?
# Is this an exception in the use of 的?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2011-12-14)

I know that, when expressing possessives, we add 的 to the usual personal pronouns, such as 我的.

However, in a question in my grammar textbook I saw:

> 你爸爸忙吗? = Is your father busy?

Why not "你**的**爸爸忙吗？"?

Are there any other exceptional or particular uses of 的 that are worth being mentioned here?

**Tags:** mandarin, possessives


---

## 4 answers

### Answer by username_4 on 2011-12-14. Score: 15 | Accepted answer

When 的 is used for possession or 's, it is often omitted in speaking when it's the subject of a sentence.
For example:

她(的)家很漂亮/她(的)家很漂亮 = Her house/home is beautiful.  
你(的)電腦很慢/你(的)电脑很慢 = Your computer is really slow.  
他(的)新車很貴/他(的)新车很贵 = His new car is quite expensive.

But 的 is usually kept when it's the object of a sentence.

我喜歡他的車/我喜欢他的车 = I like his car.

But then, again as in any language, there is always exceptions :(

For example:
我去過他(的)家/我去过他(的)家 = I've been to his house.

And because of this omission, interesting sentences like this one can come up occasionally in daily conversation:

他媽的洋裝很高雅/他妈的洋装很高雅 = His mother's dress is very elegant.

If you say this out loud, most Chinese people would pick up "他媽的" (damn, sh\*t, bloody, f\*cking depending on context) and think you are cursing for a split second before you finish the sentence. While this is not a serious problem in casual conversation, one way to avoid this awkward confusion is to explicitly say "他媽媽的".

> Added simplified Chinese after the original examples in Traditional Chinese as requested.

> **Comments:**
> **username_2**: actually, 他妈妈的 is almost the same meaning with 他妈的, oops ...  
> **username_4**: Interesting, I've never come across the usage of 他媽媽的 in offensive/cursing manner. Having said that, if one says "他媽媽的洋裝", it'd be less likely to be taken as offensive when the words come out of your mouth.  
> **username_2**: It depends on the tongue and context. If you say 他妈的洋装 and people talked to feel offensive, then your change to say 他妈妈的洋装 won't help you out of the embarrassment.  
> **username_0**: Thanks, nice answer... Are you using Traditional characters?  
> **username_4**: @username_0 Yes, I use Traditional characters (^_^) Feel free to drop me a line if you need any help with it.  
> **username_0**: @username_4 If possible can you write also the simplified version of the first examples you wrote? Don't delete the traditional though, I want to see them both so I can see the differences.  
> **username_4**: @username_0 simplified chinese added as requested ;) You can find many Traditional to Simplified converters on the web too :)  
> **username_0**: @username_4 Very kind! Thanks! I see... Well, for now I'm a student of Mandarin, but learning some Traditional on the way won't harm... :D  
> **username_4**: @username_0 no problem at all ;) I just love the beautiful intricacy of Traditional characters and I find it easier to learn simplified ones coming from a Traditional background.  

---

### Answer by username_1 on 2011-12-14. Score: 7

Both `你爸爸忙吗?` and `你的爸爸忙吗?` are possible. Perhaps because of high degree of collocation that `的` gets elided. In Chinese it is usually possible to express something similar to a genitive without `的` in between. I think instead of two nouns in a genitive relation, it becomes a single compound noun instead. Semantically equivalent but the grammatical make up behind it is slightly different.

Consider:

> 我的国家 > 我国

> **Comments:**
> **username_2**: I think 我的国家 is more emotional and usually used in written chinese or you make a speech.  

---

### Answer by username_3 on 2011-12-14. Score: 3

I think the omitting of "的" of possessives in object of a sentence is done by
following situations:

* a person have some relationship with preceding person
* or just some place after a movement "去、来、上、下、到"
* or some words preceding by attribute "这，那"

e.g.

> * places: "去你家","来我国","去他办公室","去他车上","到我这里"
> * relationships: "问她爸","找他小孩"，”看望他奶奶“
> * attribute: "坐他那车", "用我这笔"
>
> and add "的" if followed by other things "坐他的车", "找她的笔", "用你的电脑", "讲他的笑话".
>
> and more. you can omit the one if it's still the attribute of following words. "坐他(的)车的后座", "用你(的)电脑的主机", "找她(的)钢笔的套子"

> **Comments:**
> **username_4**: May I make a suggestion here. While I find this is a good answer, I think it'd be helpful to those that are learning the language if you could provide English translation for any Chinese examples given in your answer.  

---

### Answer by username_5 on 2011-12-16. Score: 0

Since you are asking "exception in the use of 的", just thought worth mentioning other meanings of `的` here.

* 的(dí) means indeed. For example: `的确`
* 的(dì) means object/aim/target/goal. For example: `目的`


---

