<p>@user970696 emmm i ve checked all your comments and i guess you are somehow mislead by some strict rules. You may have perceived that 很 more or less conveys comparison. 石炭纪的蕨类植物很大(The Carboniferous ferns are huge in size)(They are considerably huge compared with plants today)   这部电话很白 you more or less emphasize its white color. Why do you say that? The reason may come from the feature of generalized kind. (There are few phones that are so white)or from context (-我这电话买了十年了-那这电话很白啊)(-I bought the phone ten years ago-Oh, it's still that white!(It should looks old after using for so long)) So 我家猫很黑 is not simply "my cat is black". Try to learn different implication of 很:</p>

<p>我养的柴犬很黑(Because Shiba Inu is usually ginger)(So the comparison is between my dog and common Shiba Inu)
我的猫很黑，但毛却发亮(My cat is black, but he has shiny fur)(the comparison is between my cat and common black but dull cat)
蚂蚁很小(Ants are small compared with many animals we often see)</p>

<p>If you just say ...很... without explicit or inexplict comparison, it's correct but just strange.</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-19T20:52:56.800Z
Awkward but very interesting point of view. Thanks!
Enrico Brasil
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T12:28:37.620Z
2018-09-14T12:48:26.490Z
2018-09-14T12:48:26.490Z
Toosky Hierot
<ul>
<li><p>是 (is) a verb </p></li>
<li><p>黑色的 (black) is an adjective phrase</p></li>
<li><p>狗 (dog) is a noun</p></li>
</ul>

<p>Therefore, '是' (is) certainly can be used with '黑色的狗 ' (black dog) and form the phrase: "是黑色的狗" (is a black dog)</p>

<ul>
<li>'很'(very) is an adverb</li>
</ul>

<p>Therefore, it can be used with adjective '黑' (black)
and form the phrase: "是很黑的狗" (is a very black dog)</p>

<p><em>'是很黑色的狗' doesn't work because unlike '黑' which can has different degree</em> </p>

<p><em>'黑色的' is a general description that doesn't has different levels. Any level of black is '黑色的'</em></p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-11T19:31:57.380Z
Thanks but ultimately - is that true because a color is an objective fact? Because normally, most Chinese textbooks teach us: never use "shi" to link an adjective and a noun. Because for other adjectives, e.g. smart,tall or small,  "hen" would need to be used.
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-11T19:39:51.750Z
In other words - can I say "the sky is blue" and use "hen"?
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-11T19:44:39.850Z
Yes, you can use '很' in  天空(subject) 是(verb) 蓝色的(blue)  and form the sentence: "天空(subject) 是(verb) 很蓝的 (very blue). " (蓝色的 doesn't work,  it is a general description that doesn't has different levels. Any level of blue is '蓝色的', therefore, you can only say '很蓝的' but not '很蓝色的'
Tang Ho
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-11T19:46:21.833Z
So colors are treated like nouns - and it confirms the statement that it is an objective fact. If I say "sky is cold" I think I would need "hen", because "cold" is relative.
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-11T19:51:00.460Z
No, 'blue' is an adjective in your example. Just like 'cold' is an adjective. You can say "天空是冷的" (the sky is cold) or "天空是很冷的" (the sky is very cold); you can also say "是黑狗" (is a black dog) or "是很黑的狗" (is a very black dog)
Tang Ho
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-12T06:48:45.340Z
I mean they are treated like nouns because you cannot use "hen" to mean simply "is". "Dog is small" and "Dog is black" - I cannot use "hen" in both sentences to mean "is", this is what I mean. In the second sentence I would need to use "shi". I even remember some Chinese teacher mentioning that colours, when adding "de", become a noun like in English (the blue one). I edited my question, I think you are answering a bit different aspect.
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-12T06:58:05.063Z
From an article: When you are describing something that is a fact or perceived fact, you no longer use the formula listed above. Adjectives like “tall, difficult, long, and disastrous” are relative and depend on the situation. A perceived fact would be something that is indisputable, such as color.

 So saying “The dress is blue” in Chinese would not be “裙子很蓝.” This is incorrect and would translate into “The dress is very blue.” Instead, to say “the dress is blue,” you would say, “裙子是蓝色的.” The formula is as follows: Noun + “是” + Adjective + “的.”
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-12T08:19:36.487Z
@user970696 What you're describing is gradability of adjectives, not objectivity. And in Chinese (just as in English), there are some contexts where you _can_ say "今天天很蓝！"
Michaelyus
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-12T08:35:44.727Z
@user970696 Your issue is that you have misparsed the structure of 蓝色. Colours in Chinese ending 色 can behave as _nouns_, not just as adjectives.
Michaelyus
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-12T09:02:25.157Z
@Michaelyus The point of this question is that you cannot say "Dog is small" and "Dog is black" using the same structure. The former requires 很 while the latter requires 是...的. The grammar article explains as follows:  是 + Adj + 的—to state or emphasize a fact or a perceived fact. I am just curious what else than color is a perceived fact.
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-19T20:52:11.837Z
Yes, you can. 狗是小的。狗很小。狗是黑的。狗很黑。
Enrico Brasil
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-11T19:29:23.013Z
2018-09-11T19:33:07.247Z
2018-09-11T19:33:07.247Z
Tang Ho
<p>FWIW, Google translate has:</p>

<p>her story is <strong>true</strong> - 她的故事是<strong>真</strong>的</p>

<p>the cup is <strong>empty</strong> - 杯子是<strong>空</strong>的</p>

<p>the wall is <strong>perpendicular</strong> - 墙是<strong>垂直</strong>的</p>

<p>是。。。的 turns up in many different contexts, and can be used with any adjective, and with things other than adjectives as well. It is often used for emphasis. </p>

<p>That article (<a href="https://www.digmandarin.com/using-hen-with-adjectives.html" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://www.digmandarin.com/using-hen-with-adjectives.html</a>) is saying that 是。。。的 is the unmarked (default) translation for colours, but there are still circumstances were you could use 很。</p>

<p>In response to your comment: Yes, just use 是。。。的。狗 是 黑色 的。You can use 很 if you want to emphasise the 'very'. </p>

<p>The sky is blue - 天是蓝色的</p>

<p>The sky is very blue today - 今天天很蓝</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T11:12:21.837Z
Thanks but that is the thing, I would like to understand where I can and cannot use it. For example, would you say 狗很黑 when describing a dog? From what I read,color is a fact (not relative) and 是。。。的 should be used.
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T10:29:31.963Z
2018-09-15T02:00:38.720Z
2018-09-15T02:00:38.720Z
user20347
<p>There are the simplified rules about never using "shi" to link an adjective with a noun. However, I believe this is not true for facts or perceived facts, such as colors, then I should use "shi" to mean simply "is":
When I say: The dog is black: 狗是黑色的. </p>

<p>And cannot say: 狗很黑色</p>

<p>I think when using 很, the meaning changes, it does not mean "IS" anymore. And that is the thing.</p>

<p>Is that correct? I read it in an article but on the other hand, many other articles just mention the simple rule I mentioned above.</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-13T23:38:16.563Z
狗很黑 is also legit.
Kevin. Fang
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T10:00:38.867Z
@Kevin.Fang Is it? According to some mandarin speakers, that is incorrect.
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T11:26:44.683Z
@user970696 狗很黑 is grammarly legit. But it means "The dog (this species) is generally black" .
Toosky Hierot
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T11:29:34.097Z
@TooskyHierot And that is what I mean. So it is not the same and I would like to understand when I need to use 是。。。的.
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T11:46:02.643Z
@user970696 the meaning of 是...的 always depends other components. when there isn't 这/那 etc. xx 是 xx 的 means the feature/property of its kind. However, if the subject is specified then it means otherwise. But note that, this structure is not common to stand alone as a whole sentence... I've only seen it on children's reading or poorly translated works, like 太阳是红的，花是香的，草儿是绿的 and 上帝说：这是好的 etc. (Not that natural)
Toosky Hierot
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T12:01:24.080Z
@TooskyHierot I mean in simple sentences. Like: This phone is white. My cat is black. I think I cannot use 很", but I do not know why
John V
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-14T12:29:22.157Z
@user970696 I just posted an answer below
Toosky Hierot
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-09-15T07:08:42.147Z
@user970696 Yeah I mean it's legit in terms of grammar, compared to 狗很黑色 which is incorrect in any case.
Kevin. Fang
<grammar><adjectives>
Shi / Hen for adjective + noun when discussing facts or perceived facts
# Shi / Hen for adjective + noun when discussing facts or perceived facts

(Asked by: username_0 on 2018-09-11)

There are the simplified rules about never using "shi" to link an adjective with a noun. However, I believe this is not true for facts or perceived facts, such as colors, then I should use "shi" to mean simply "is":
When I say: The dog is black: 狗是黑色的.

And cannot say: 狗很黑色

I think when using 很, the meaning changes, it does not mean "IS" anymore. And that is the thing.

Is that correct? I read it in an article but on the other hand, many other articles just mention the simple rule I mentioned above.

**Tags:** grammar, adjectives

> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: 狗很黑 is also legit.  
> **username_0**: @username_1 Is it? According to some mandarin speakers, that is incorrect.  
> **username_2**: @user970696 狗很黑 is grammarly legit. But it means "The dog (this species) is generally black" .  
> **username_0**: @username_2 And that is what I mean. So it is not the same and I would like to understand when I need to use 是。。。的.  
> **username_2**: @user970696 the meaning of 是...的 always depends other components. when there isn't 这/那 etc. xx 是 xx 的 means the feature/property of its kind. However, if the subject is specified then it means otherwise. But note that, this structure is not common to stand alone as a whole sentence... I've only seen it on children's reading or poorly translated works, like 太阳是红的，花是香的，草儿是绿的 and 上帝说：这是好的 etc. (Not that natural)  
> **username_0**: @username_2 I mean in simple sentences. Like: This phone is white. My cat is black. I think I cannot use 很", but I do not know why  
> **username_2**: @user970696 I just posted an answer below  
> **username_1**: @user970696 Yeah I mean it's legit in terms of grammar, compared to 狗很黑色 which is incorrect in any case.  

---

## 3 answers

### Answer by username_2 on 2018-09-14. Score: 2

@user970696 emmm i ve checked all your comments and i guess you are somehow mislead by some strict rules. You may have perceived that 很 more or less conveys comparison. 石炭纪的蕨类植物很大(The Carboniferous ferns are huge in size)(They are considerably huge compared with plants today) 这部电话很白 you more or less emphasize its white color. Why do you say that? The reason may come from the feature of generalized kind. (There are few phones that are so white)or from context (-我这电话买了十年了-那这电话很白啊)(-I bought the phone ten years ago-Oh, it's still that white!(It should looks old after using for so long)) So 我家猫很黑 is not simply "my cat is black". Try to learn different implication of 很:

我养的柴犬很黑(Because Shiba Inu is usually ginger)(So the comparison is between my dog and common Shiba Inu)
我的猫很黑，但毛却发亮(My cat is black, but he has shiny fur)(the comparison is between my cat and common black but dull cat)
蚂蚁很小(Ants are small compared with many animals we often see)

If you just say ...很... without explicit or inexplict comparison, it's correct but just strange.

> **Comments:**
> **username_3**: Awkward but very interesting point of view. Thanks!  

---

### Answer by username_4 on 2018-09-11. Score: 1

* 是 (is) a verb
* 黑色的 (black) is an adjective phrase
* 狗 (dog) is a noun

Therefore, '是' (is) certainly can be used with '黑色的狗 ' (black dog) and form the phrase: "是黑色的狗" (is a black dog)

* '很'(very) is an adverb

Therefore, it can be used with adjective '黑' (black)
and form the phrase: "是很黑的狗" (is a very black dog)

*'是很黑色的狗' doesn't work because unlike '黑' which can has different degree*

*'黑色的' is a general description that doesn't has different levels. Any level of black is '黑色的'*

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: Thanks but ultimately - is that true because a color is an objective fact? Because normally, most Chinese textbooks teach us: never use "shi" to link an adjective and a noun. Because for other adjectives, e.g. smart,tall or small,  "hen" would need to be used.  
> **username_0**: In other words - can I say "the sky is blue" and use "hen"?  
> **username_4**: Yes, you can use '很' in  天空(subject) 是(verb) 蓝色的(blue)  and form the sentence: "天空(subject) 是(verb) 很蓝的 (very blue). " (蓝色的 doesn't work,  it is a general description that doesn't has different levels. Any level of blue is '蓝色的', therefore, you can only say '很蓝的' but not '很蓝色的'  
> **username_0**: So colors are treated like nouns - and it confirms the statement that it is an objective fact. If I say "sky is cold" I think I would need "hen", because "cold" is relative.  
> **username_4**: No, 'blue' is an adjective in your example. Just like 'cold' is an adjective. You can say "天空是冷的" (the sky is cold) or "天空是很冷的" (the sky is very cold); you can also say "是黑狗" (is a black dog) or "是很黑的狗" (is a very black dog)  
> **username_0**: I mean they are treated like nouns because you cannot use "hen" to mean simply "is". "Dog is small" and "Dog is black" - I cannot use "hen" in both sentences to mean "is", this is what I mean. In the second sentence I would need to use "shi". I even remember some Chinese teacher mentioning that colours, when adding "de", become a noun like in English (the blue one). I edited my question, I think you are answering a bit different aspect.  
> **username_0**: From an article: When you are describing something that is a fact or perceived fact, you no longer use the formula listed above. Adjectives like “tall, difficult, long, and disastrous” are relative and depend on the situation. A perceived fact would be something that is indisputable, such as color.   So saying “The dress is blue” in Chinese would not be “裙子很蓝.” This is incorrect and would translate into “The dress is very blue.” Instead, to say “the dress is blue,” you would say, “裙子是蓝色的.” The formula is as follows: Noun + “是” + Adjective + “的.”  
> **username_5**: @user970696 What you're describing is gradability of adjectives, not objectivity. And in Chinese (just as in English), there are some contexts where you _can_ say "今天天很蓝！"  
> **username_5**: @user970696 Your issue is that you have misparsed the structure of 蓝色. Colours in Chinese ending 色 can behave as _nouns_, not just as adjectives.  
> **username_0**: @username_5 The point of this question is that you cannot say "Dog is small" and "Dog is black" using the same structure. The former requires 很 while the latter requires 是...的. The grammar article explains as follows:  是 + Adj + 的—to state or emphasize a fact or a perceived fact. I am just curious what else than color is a perceived fact.  
> **username_3**: Yes, you can. 狗是小的。狗很小。狗是黑的。狗很黑。  

---

### Answer by username_6 on 2018-09-14. Score: 0

FWIW, Google translate has:

her story is **true** - 她的故事是**真**的

the cup is **empty** - 杯子是**空**的

the wall is **perpendicular** - 墙是**垂直**的

是。。。的 turns up in many different contexts, and can be used with any adjective, and with things other than adjectives as well. It is often used for emphasis.

That article (<https://www.digmandarin.com/using-hen-with-adjectives.html>) is saying that 是。。。的 is the unmarked (default) translation for colours, but there are still circumstances were you could use 很。

In response to your comment: Yes, just use 是。。。的。狗 是 黑色 的。You can use 很 if you want to emphasise the 'very'.

The sky is blue - 天是蓝色的

The sky is very blue today - 今天天很蓝

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: Thanks but that is the thing, I would like to understand where I can and cannot use it. For example, would you say 狗很黑 when describing a dog? From what I read,color is a fact (not relative) and 是。。。的 should be used.  

---

