<blockquote>
  <p>I infer that the moon would be setting in about 2 hours so the tide should be low in about 3 hours, that is, around 21:00 PDT. How can the discrepancy be explained?</p>
</blockquote>

<p>Your inference is based on multiple misconceptions. The key misconception is that the tides at La Jolla are solely due to the Moon's position in the sky. A secondary misconception is that the time of moonset is a key indicator with regard to the tides at La Jolla.</p>

<p>With regard to the latter, we're often told that the Moon rises and sets 50 minutes later than it did the day before. While this is the average behavior, it is rarely the actual behavior<sup>1</sup>. The time between subsequent moonrises/moonsets can vary quite a bit from this mean, with the variation depending on the phase of the Moon, the time of the year, the latitude of the observer, and other influences. For La Jolla, the times between subsequent moonrises/moonsets just for October 2018 varies from 36 minutes to 68 minutes later than on the previous day.</p>

<p>With regard to the former, the tides at La Jolla result from several cyclical influences, plus non-cyclical variations caused by things such as weather. The key cyclical influences, from <a href="https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/harcon.html?id=9410230" rel="noreferrer">Harmonic Constituents - NOAA Tides and Currents</a> for La Jolla are</p>

<pre><code>Name   Amplitude (ft)  Phase(°)  Speed (°/hr)
 M2      1.64           270.1     28.984104
 K1      1.089           86.6     15.041069
 O1      0.699           80.2     13.943035
 S2      0.669          258.5     30.0
 N2      0.384          254.1     28.43973
 P1      0.344           83.4     14.958931
 SA      0.259          175.3      0.0410686
 Q1      0.125           77.2     13.398661
</code></pre>

<p>The above shows that the M2 tidal constituent is dominant at La Jolla, but it also shows that it is not overwhelmingly so. The predicted tides result from the composition of these constituents, plus a bunch of smaller constituents that I did not list. The predicted tide levels for La Jolla CA for October 2018 is shown below. Note the complex pattern of beats in the graph.</p>

<p><a href="https://i.sstatic.net/o7VAg.jpg" rel="noreferrer"><img src="https://i.sstatic.net/o7VAg.jpg" alt="Graph of tide predictions for La Jolla CA for October 2018."></a><br>
<sup>Source: <a href="https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/noaatidepredictions.html?id=9410230" rel="noreferrer">https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/noaatidepredictions.html?id=9410230</a></sup></p>

<hr>

<p><sub><sup>1</sup>Three statisticians went duck hunting. Two shot at a duck. Both missed, one ten feet to the left, the other ten to the right. The third proclaimed "We hit, on average!"</sub></p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-10-12T17:54:02.953Z
See also David's similarly great answer in [How come the tide is low when the moon is high in the sky](https://earthscience.stackexchange.com/questions/12588/how-come-the-tide-is-low-when-the-moon-is-high-in-the-sky)
JeopardyTempest
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-10-12T10:51:32.747Z
2018-10-12T10:51:32.747Z
David Hammen
<p>At 18:03 PDT at La Jolla Cove the lifeguard's bulletin board stated predicted low tide at 5:36 (17:36 PDT?). In fact, it was already after 6:00 and the sun had not yet set. The moon was a waxing crescent, about 2 days old. I infer that the moon would be setting in about 2 hours so the tide should be low in about 3 hours, that is, around 21:00 PDT. How can the discrepancy be explained?</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-10-12T04:49:27.450Z
It's an interesting question. You have described four points in time. Double checking, are you asking for the discrepancy between 17:36 and 21:00, or between  17:36 and 18:03? What is the significance of 18:03 to the question, is that just the time that you read the posting?
uhoh
CC BY-SA 4.0
2018-10-12T08:51:25.040Z
This apparently was for 2018 October 11, where low tide at the La Jolla CA tidal station was at 17:37 PDT. On this day, the Sun set at 18:26 PDT and the Moon set at 20:32 PDT. Tidal data from [Tide Predictions - NOAA Tides and Currents](https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/noaatidepredictions.html?id=9410230), sunset from [Sunrise and sunset times for La Jolla Beach](https://www.timeanddate.com/sun/@5361133), and moonset from [Moonrise, Moonset, and Phase Calendar for La Jolla Beach](https://www.timeanddate.com/moon/@5361133).
David Hammen
<oceanography>
predicting low tide
user14024
# predicting low tide

(Asked by: username_0 on 2018-10-12)

At 18:03 PDT at La Jolla Cove the lifeguard's bulletin board stated predicted low tide at 5:36 (17:36 PDT?). In fact, it was already after 6:00 and the sun had not yet set. The moon was a waxing crescent, about 2 days old. I infer that the moon would be setting in about 2 hours so the tide should be low in about 3 hours, that is, around 21:00 PDT. How can the discrepancy be explained?

**Tags:** oceanography

> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: It's an interesting question. You have described four points in time. Double checking, are you asking for the discrepancy between 17:36 and 21:00, or between  17:36 and 18:03? What is the significance of 18:03 to the question, is that just the time that you read the posting?  
> **username_2**: This apparently was for 2018 October 11, where low tide at the La Jolla CA tidal station was at 17:37 PDT. On this day, the Sun set at 18:26 PDT and the Moon set at 20:32 PDT. Tidal data from [Tide Predictions - NOAA Tides and Currents](https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/noaatidepredictions.html?id=9410230), sunset from [Sunrise and sunset times for La Jolla Beach](https://www.timeanddate.com/sun/@5361133), and moonset from [Moonrise, Moonset, and Phase Calendar for La Jolla Beach](https://www.timeanddate.com/moon/@5361133).  

---

## 1 answers

### Answer by username_2 on 2018-10-12. Score: 5

> I infer that the moon would be setting in about 2 hours so the tide should be low in about 3 hours, that is, around 21:00 PDT. How can the discrepancy be explained?

Your inference is based on multiple misconceptions. The key misconception is that the tides at La Jolla are solely due to the Moon's position in the sky. A secondary misconception is that the time of moonset is a key indicator with regard to the tides at La Jolla.

With regard to the latter, we're often told that the Moon rises and sets 50 minutes later than it did the day before. While this is the average behavior, it is rarely the actual behavior1. The time between subsequent moonrises/moonsets can vary quite a bit from this mean, with the variation depending on the phase of the Moon, the time of the year, the latitude of the observer, and other influences. For La Jolla, the times between subsequent moonrises/moonsets just for October 2018 varies from 36 minutes to 68 minutes later than on the previous day.

With regard to the former, the tides at La Jolla result from several cyclical influences, plus non-cyclical variations caused by things such as weather. The key cyclical influences, from [Harmonic Constituents - NOAA Tides and Currents](https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/harcon.html?id=9410230) for La Jolla are

```
Name   Amplitude (ft)  Phase(°)  Speed (°/hr)
 M2      1.64           270.1     28.984104
 K1      1.089           86.6     15.041069
 O1      0.699           80.2     13.943035
 S2      0.669          258.5     30.0
 N2      0.384          254.1     28.43973
 P1      0.344           83.4     14.958931
 SA      0.259          175.3      0.0410686
 Q1      0.125           77.2     13.398661

```

The above shows that the M2 tidal constituent is dominant at La Jolla, but it also shows that it is not overwhelmingly so. The predicted tides result from the composition of these constituents, plus a bunch of smaller constituents that I did not list. The predicted tide levels for La Jolla CA for October 2018 is shown below. Note the complex pattern of beats in the graph.

[![Graph of tide predictions for La Jolla CA for October 2018.](https://i.sstatic.net/o7VAg.jpg)](https://i.sstatic.net/o7VAg.jpg)  
Source: <https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/noaatidepredictions.html?id=9410230>

---

1Three statisticians went duck hunting. Two shot at a duck. Both missed, one ten feet to the left, the other ten to the right. The third proclaimed "We hit, on average!"

> **Comments:**
> **username_3**: See also username_2's similarly great answer in [How come the tide is low when the moon is high in the sky](https://earthscience.stackexchange.com/questions/12588/how-come-the-tide-is-low-when-the-moon-is-high-in-the-sky)  

---

