<p>The Gulf Stream is one reason why. The other is the Labrador current.</p>

<p>The warm <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_stream">Gulf Stream</a> runs southwest to northeast, and carries warmth from the Gulf of Mexico to western Europe. Hence, this part of the world is warmer than other parts of the world where the latitudes are similar, but the currents are "neutral."</p>

<p>The cold <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labrador_Current">Labrador current</a> runs northeast to southwest along the East coast of North America, bringing "arctic" influences into play. Hence the East coast of North America is colder than normal for that latitude. Tapio Schneider, cited in the question, concedes as much by <a href="http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v471/n7340/full/nature09924.html?WT.ec_id=NATURE-20110331">saying,</a> "Our results show that warm ocean waters contribute to the contrast in mid-latitude winter temperatures between eastern and western continental boundaries not only by warming western boundaries, but also by cooling eastern boundaries."</p>

<p>Between the two influences, Western Europe is warmer than the northeast United States at comparable latitudes. </p>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-05-19T08:43:48.527Z
Downvoted, as this simply repeats the "general knowledge" answer that was given in the question, and does not address any of the contrary views in the linked articles.
Semidiurnal Simon
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-05-25T22:06:40.310Z
@SimonW: I cited Tapio Schneider's argument linked in the question to support my answer. Even if the Gulf Stream doesn't make western Europe warmer than normal for the latitude, Schneider conceded that the Labrador current makes Northeast North America colder than normal, hence Western Europe is "warmer" by comparison.
Tom Au
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T21:57:39.007Z
This answer needs some sources, and I don't mean simple links to Wikipedia, but expert sources actually going into the debate linked in the question, such as scientific articles replying or reviewing Seagers article(s).
gerrit
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T21:55:07.393Z
2014-05-25T21:46:00.600Z
2014-05-25T21:46:00.600Z
Tom Au
<p>It is true that the Gulf Stream plays a role on the different climates of each region; I would not call it an 'urban legend' as Richard Seager and other scientists put it, however it seems that how much it actually changes the climate is currently under debate.</p>
<p>From <a href="http://www.americanscientist.org/issues/issue.aspx?id=999&amp;y=0&amp;no=&amp;content=true&amp;page=5&amp;css=print" rel="noreferrer">Wallace Broeker</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>One of the major elements of today's ocean system is a conveyor-like circulation that delivers an enormous amount of tropical heat to the northern Atlantic. During winter, this heat is released to the overlying eastward air masses, thereby greatly ameliorating winter temperatures in northern Europe.</p>
</blockquote>
<p><img src="https://i.sstatic.net/92rhj.jpg" alt="enter image description here" /></p>
<blockquote>
<p>Thermohaline circulation—often dubbed &quot;the ocean conveyor belt&quot;—carries warm surface waters (<em>pink</em>) from the tropics to the North Atlantic, with the return flow at depth (<em>purple</em>). But contrary to many accounts (summarized by diagrams such as this), this heat conveyor plays only a minor role in keeping European countries warm during winter months.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>It seems that although, as you stated, the Gulf Stream traditionally was thought to play a major role in the climate difference, new studies emerging shows that <a href="http://www.livescience.com/13573-east-coast-colder-europe-west-coast.html" rel="noreferrer">only contributes a small amount</a> to the temperature difference.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>The cooling effect could account for 30 to 50 percent of the temperature difference across oceans, the study suggests.  It also explains why the cold region is just as big for both North America and Asia, despite the continents' differences in topography and size.</p>
<p>The cooling depends on heating air over warm ocean water. Since the warm currents along western ocean boundaries in both the Pacific and Atlantic are similar, the resulting cold region to their west would be similar as well.  The <strong>new study</strong> adds to other recent research that found that ocean currents such as the Gulf Stream aren't capable of transporting that much heat to northern Europe, instead contributing only up to <em>10 percent of their warming</em>.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>There are also studies suggesting that the conveyor belt model itself was <a href="http://www.livescience.com/8317-kinks-ocean-conveyor-belt.html" rel="noreferrer">extremely oversimplified</a>, and its role in ocean overturning cycles is being re-evaluated:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>As the study of the modern ocean’s role in climate continues apace, the conveyor belt model no longer serves the community well — not because it is a gross oversimplification but because it ignores crucial structure and mechanics of the ocean’s intricate global overturning.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Based on the evidence at hand, I believe that the Gulf Stream <em>does</em> play a role in making Europe warmer than North America at similar latitudes; however how large a role it plays perhaps has been overestimated, and with the new ongoing studies perhaps different climate elements, such as the <a href="http://all-geo.org/highlyallochthonous/2012/06/what-do-you-mean-the-gulf-stream-doesnt-keep-europe-warm-how-even-scientists-are-afflicted-by-urban-myths/" rel="noreferrer">atmospheric elements</a>rather than the oceanic currents, can be modeled and brought to light in the scientific community, much as Richard Seager is doing now.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>The oceans do still play an important role in keeping Europe’s winters mild, but it is nothing to do with the Gulf Stream. The winds that blow northeast onto Europe from the Atlantic carry with them air that is relatively warm even in the winter; the large heat capacity of water means that the sea cools off more slowly in the winter, and this also moderates the temperature of the air above the sea surface. This contrasts with the eastern US, where the prevailing southeast winds are cold, having lost their heat to the thousands of kilometres of land surface they’ve already passed over.</p>
<p>So the oceans are still involved, but it is the atmosphere that is the true key to explaining Europe’s mild winters; and in a pleasing geological twist, it is apparently the presence of the Rocky Mountains that causes the large scale waviness of atmospheric circulation that magnifies the temperature contrasts on either side of The Pond (Richard Seager explains this in more detail in this more comprehensive piece at the American Scientist).</p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-05-19T21:08:01.297Z
I find it a bit unclear from your quotations who says what.  For example, your Wallace Broeker link actually links to an article by Richard Saeger (who does quote Broeker, only to comment his assertion is misleading), and the quote immediately following the first diagram is not from that article...
gerrit
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-05-20T01:12:53.463Z
Yes, I was using the Wallace Broeker comment as an example of a different opinion regarding the Gulf Stream.  The first diagram, and the quote immediately following the first diagram actually are from that article, if you scroll down and click 'enlarge image' it is the quote that explains the figure itself.
Bunk
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-05-19T18:49:34.590Z
2014-05-19T18:49:34.590Z
2020-06-18T08:25:19.090Z
Bunk
<p>Traditionally it has thought to be the Gulf Stream. But other researchers, like <a href="https://www.americanscientist.org/issues/issue.aspx?id=999&amp;y=0&amp;no=&amp;content=true&amp;page=5&amp;css=print">Richard Seager</a> and <a href="http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v471/n7340/full/nature09924.html?WT.ec_id=NATURE-20110331">Tapio Schneider</a>, propose different arguments as to why.</p>

<p>How much of a role does the Gulf Stream really play? Who is right? (or are they all at least partially right?)</p>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2017-01-25T15:53:01.417Z
Where in Europe and where in N.A., you are comparing vast areas that have large variability within them even at similar latitudes. For example Palermo and San Francisco are at a similar latitude but have similar climate. Milan is more south than Seattle but is just as cold if not colder than Seattle.
Herman Toothrot
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-04-29T09:08:58.133Z
@HermanToothrot I understand your comment, but Milan is not colder than Seattle, check https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milan#Climate vs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle#Climate, Seattle may have higher average high, but the daily mean and mean minimum are both lower than Milan
EarlGrey
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-04-29T09:53:33.040Z
@EarlGrey could have made a better example, such as Milan and Chicago, the idea was same latitude and different climate.
Herman Toothrot
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-05-19T08:44:19.390Z
Interesting question, but I think it would be greatly improved by briefly summarising the arguments in the links rather than just linking them.
Semidiurnal Simon
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T21:49:17.957Z
Seems like a rhetorical question. Would you like to elaborate on those other arguments?
winwaed
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T21:51:13.333Z
Okay sure, I've added in some links and information.
InquilineKea
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T22:07:24.797Z
Specifically, could you point to a *scientific* source describing the gulf stream (or rather the [North Atlantic Current](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Atlantic_drift)) as responsible for the Europe - N-America temperature difference?  As far as I can tell, the Saeger article is not highly controversial.
gerrit
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T22:08:33.527Z
It doesn't seem to be, though there certainly still is a widespread belief in the Gulf Stream being responsible. There also are some differences between the Seager and Tapio Schneider interpretations.
InquilineKea
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T22:16:46.600Z
@InquilineKea There is indeed such a widespread belief, reiterated by the two basically unsourced answers.  That's why yours is a good question and I hope for an expert answer explaining (1) the background of the widespread belief (2) whether the widespread belief has scientific merit (3) the present scientific consensus (4) any significant scientific minority opinions.  I don't feel confident enough to give that answer myself, as I wouldn't get further than summarising the Seager papers, but maybe I'll give it a try later.
gerrit
CC BY-SA 3.0
2014-04-15T22:31:42.700Z
It is a very good question, though.  I think it could be improved with a better formulation, but it certainly belongs very much on this site.
gerrit
<climate>
Why is Europe warmer than North America at similar latitudes?
InquilineKea
# Why is Europe warmer than North America at similar latitudes?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2014-04-15)

Traditionally it has thought to be the Gulf Stream. But other researchers, like [Richard Seager](https://www.americanscientist.org/issues/issue.aspx?id=999&y=0&no=&content=true&page=5&css=print) and [Tapio Schneider](http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v471/n7340/full/nature09924.html?WT.ec_id=NATURE-20110331), propose different arguments as to why.

How much of a role does the Gulf Stream really play? Who is right? (or are they all at least partially right?)

**Tags:** climate

> **Comments:**
> **username_4**: Seems like a rhetorical question. Would you like to elaborate on those other arguments?  
> **username_0**: Okay sure, I've added in some links and information.  
> **username_5**: Specifically, could you point to a *scientific* source describing the gulf stream (or rather the [North Atlantic Current](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Atlantic_drift)) as responsible for the Europe - N-America temperature difference?  As far as I can tell, the Saeger article is not highly controversial.  
> **username_0**: It doesn't seem to be, though there certainly still is a widespread belief in the Gulf Stream being responsible. There also are some differences between the Seager and Tapio Schneider interpretations.  
> **username_5**: @username_0 There is indeed such a widespread belief, reiterated by the two basically unsourced answers.  That's why yours is a good question and I hope for an expert answer explaining (1) the background of the widespread belief (2) whether the widespread belief has scientific merit (3) the present scientific consensus (4) any significant scientific minority opinions.  I don't feel confident enough to give that answer myself, as I wouldn't get further than summarising the Seager papers, but maybe I'll give it a try later.  
> **username_5**: It is a very good question, though.  I think it could be improved with a better formulation, but it certainly belongs very much on this site.  
> **username_3**: Interesting question, but I think it would be greatly improved by briefly summarising the arguments in the links rather than just linking them.  
> **username_1**: Where in Europe and where in N.A., you are comparing vast areas that have large variability within them even at similar latitudes. For example Palermo and San Francisco are at a similar latitude but have similar climate. Milan is more south than Seattle but is just as cold if not colder than Seattle.  
> **username_2**: @username_1 I understand your comment, but Milan is not colder than Seattle, check https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milan#Climate vs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle#Climate, Seattle may have higher average high, but the daily mean and mean minimum are both lower than Milan  
> **username_1**: @username_2 could have made a better example, such as Milan and Chicago, the idea was same latitude and different climate.  

---

## 2 answers

### Answer by username_7 on 2014-05-19. Score: 17

It is true that the Gulf Stream plays a role on the different climates of each region; I would not call it an 'urban legend' as Richard Seager and other scientists put it, however it seems that how much it actually changes the climate is currently under debate.

From [Wallace Broeker](http://www.americanscientist.org/issues/issue.aspx?id=999&y=0&no=&content=true&page=5&css=print):

> One of the major elements of today's ocean system is a conveyor-like circulation that delivers an enormous amount of tropical heat to the northern Atlantic. During winter, this heat is released to the overlying eastward air masses, thereby greatly ameliorating winter temperatures in northern Europe.

![enter image description here](https://i.sstatic.net/92rhj.jpg)

> Thermohaline circulation—often dubbed "the ocean conveyor belt"—carries warm surface waters (*pink*) from the tropics to the North Atlantic, with the return flow at depth (*purple*). But contrary to many accounts (summarized by diagrams such as this), this heat conveyor plays only a minor role in keeping European countries warm during winter months.

It seems that although, as you stated, the Gulf Stream traditionally was thought to play a major role in the climate difference, new studies emerging shows that [only contributes a small amount](http://www.livescience.com/13573-east-coast-colder-europe-west-coast.html) to the temperature difference.

> The cooling effect could account for 30 to 50 percent of the temperature difference across oceans, the study suggests. It also explains why the cold region is just as big for both North America and Asia, despite the continents' differences in topography and size.
>
> The cooling depends on heating air over warm ocean water. Since the warm currents along western ocean boundaries in both the Pacific and Atlantic are similar, the resulting cold region to their west would be similar as well. The **new study** adds to other recent research that found that ocean currents such as the Gulf Stream aren't capable of transporting that much heat to northern Europe, instead contributing only up to *10 percent of their warming*.

There are also studies suggesting that the conveyor belt model itself was [extremely oversimplified](http://www.livescience.com/8317-kinks-ocean-conveyor-belt.html), and its role in ocean overturning cycles is being re-evaluated:

> As the study of the modern ocean’s role in climate continues apace, the conveyor belt model no longer serves the community well — not because it is a gross oversimplification but because it ignores crucial structure and mechanics of the ocean’s intricate global overturning.

Based on the evidence at hand, I believe that the Gulf Stream *does* play a role in making Europe warmer than North America at similar latitudes; however how large a role it plays perhaps has been overestimated, and with the new ongoing studies perhaps different climate elements, such as the [atmospheric elements](http://all-geo.org/highlyallochthonous/2012/06/what-do-you-mean-the-gulf-stream-doesnt-keep-europe-warm-how-even-scientists-are-afflicted-by-urban-myths/)rather than the oceanic currents, can be modeled and brought to light in the scientific community, much as Richard Seager is doing now.

> The oceans do still play an important role in keeping Europe’s winters mild, but it is nothing to do with the Gulf Stream. The winds that blow northeast onto Europe from the Atlantic carry with them air that is relatively warm even in the winter; the large heat capacity of water means that the sea cools off more slowly in the winter, and this also moderates the temperature of the air above the sea surface. This contrasts with the eastern US, where the prevailing southeast winds are cold, having lost their heat to the thousands of kilometres of land surface they’ve already passed over.
>
> So the oceans are still involved, but it is the atmosphere that is the true key to explaining Europe’s mild winters; and in a pleasing geological twist, it is apparently the presence of the Rocky Mountains that causes the large scale waviness of atmospheric circulation that magnifies the temperature contrasts on either side of The Pond (Richard Seager explains this in more detail in this more comprehensive piece at the American Scientist).

> **Comments:**
> **username_5**: I find it a bit unclear from your quotations who says what.  For example, your Wallace Broeker link actually links to an article by Richard Saeger (who does quote Broeker, only to comment his assertion is misleading), and the quote immediately following the first diagram is not from that article...  
> **username_7**: Yes, I was using the Wallace Broeker comment as an example of a different opinion regarding the Gulf Stream.  The first diagram, and the quote immediately following the first diagram actually are from that article, if you scroll down and click 'enlarge image' it is the quote that explains the figure itself.  

---

### Answer by username_6 on 2014-04-15. Score: 14

The Gulf Stream is one reason why. The other is the Labrador current.

The warm [Gulf Stream](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_stream) runs southwest to northeast, and carries warmth from the Gulf of Mexico to western Europe. Hence, this part of the world is warmer than other parts of the world where the latitudes are similar, but the currents are "neutral."

The cold [Labrador current](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labrador_Current) runs northeast to southwest along the East coast of North America, bringing "arctic" influences into play. Hence the East coast of North America is colder than normal for that latitude. Tapio Schneider, cited in the question, concedes as much by [saying,](http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v471/n7340/full/nature09924.html?WT.ec_id=NATURE-20110331) "Our results show that warm ocean waters contribute to the contrast in mid-latitude winter temperatures between eastern and western continental boundaries not only by warming western boundaries, but also by cooling eastern boundaries."

Between the two influences, Western Europe is warmer than the northeast United States at comparable latitudes.

> **Comments:**
> **username_5**: This answer needs some sources, and I don't mean simple links to Wikipedia, but expert sources actually going into the debate linked in the question, such as scientific articles replying or reviewing Seagers article(s).  
> **username_3**: Downvoted, as this simply repeats the "general knowledge" answer that was given in the question, and does not address any of the contrary views in the linked articles.  
> **username_6**: @SimonW: I cited Tapio Schneider's argument linked in the question to support my answer. Even if the Gulf Stream doesn't make western Europe warmer than normal for the latitude, Schneider conceded that the Labrador current makes Northeast North America colder than normal, hence Western Europe is "warmer" by comparison.  

---

