I am currently playing a Wilson staff DX2. Its 29 compression and supposed to be the softest golf ball in the world.
I like it a lot if I'm honest (maybe not so much for putting), but I'm worried that my swing speed of 115-118 with the driver isn't doing me any favors off the tee.
i) Am I over compressing the ball with the driver?
ii) If so, is that causing problems related to dispersion, distance etc.
iii) Would I obtain better results with a different ball off the tee if my objective is to go as straight and long as possible?
iv) if 29 compression is too soft, what is the lowest compression I could still play and not have any adverse effects.
I'm nowhere near your swing speed so it might not be applicable. But even at 95 mph I have found a large difference in how various "soft" balls (Callaway SuperSoft, Srixon Soft Feel, Wilson 50 Elite or Duo, TaylorMade Burner Soft) come off the driver. They all feel softer than a ProV/x or TP5/x, but some of them seem to have a flatter trajectory than others.
I don't know if this is due to compression, dimple design, other cover/layer features and how things match up with the driver/swing I have. I mean, they are all "good quality" golf balls, so that's not the issue.
Off of the irons I can't say I've seen a noticeable difference in ball flight.
I think there are a lot of threads in the ball section on this, although I don't really know what is fact vs. fiction.
You'll get various answers that it will and that it won't. Only way to know for sure is to do your own testing....and hopefully detailed testing on a good launch monitor. If you can do that, you'll know for sure.
Nobody that I'm aware of plays the absolute lowest compression available on any of the tours.
My swing speed is in the same exact range & I've played some of the lower compression balls like the Titleist AVX. I've also hit the Wilson balls you mentioned. Both were noticeably shorter than the Bridgestone BX or BXS I usually play. I prefer a firmer feel anyhow.
With your swing speed no need to play a low compression ball, you may like the feel, but they certainly compress too much.
You should be able to play anything closer to 75 or higher without having to feel like you're losing distance off the tee.
Thanks, I will order some Bridgestone BX/S for testing.
4. It will vary company to company. The issue with a soft golf ball in the core is slow to respond. It is hard to make a soft golf ball that also has a fast core response (softer ball, more compression, longer response time). Best bet would be to get on a launch monitor with some balls you want to use. If your smash factor is around 1.5 they are working as they should. If you don't have that option look for golf balls meant for tour swing speeds. Those will all work.
Check this out. These guys know their stuff and tested out compression like you're taking about. Don't recall the results off the top of my head but pretty much everything they put on the channel is solid information. Good luck!
1) there is really no such thing as 'over compressing' in the context of how hard/soft the ball is.
3) You never know until you try. The unknown in the equation is that the softness of the ball effects the feel at impact and when it comes to changes in feel anything is possible. Just make sure your testing covers how it effects all aspects of your game. Putting, short game, iron play as well, not just driver. Also, there is a lot more to the ball and it's performance than just the softness or compression. So don't get overly fixated on connecting the results you do get to the compression.
4) see the previous answers.
Thanks guys, some great stuff to get on with.
If you get a chance you should check out some of the Golf Digest charts on spin rates, launch angle, and distance. Spoiler: off the driver every ball performs so closely to one another that it doesn't matter. Compression makes a difference in the irons because of how the inner layers react to the slower speeds that exist there.
For some reason they left out drivers in 2018, perhaps because the 2017 testing showed that it doesn't make any difference what you hit with your driver and woods.
No offense at all, but the DX2 and BX-s really aren't even comparable, one bring a super soft distance ball and one being a tour level urethane covered ball. Why not try, say, a Wilson Duo U which is still buttery soft but firmer than 29 compression and will give you some spin around the greens? That's probably my favorite ball to play, because like you I love the soft feel... though I do suspect it's not the longest off the tee.
A few other of the softest "better" balls in my experience would be the Vice Pro Soft, TM Project a, and Srixon Q Star Tour, though none are probably the longest at 115 mph.
Kind of doubt it but at your tour-level swingspeed (up near Tiger there) completely possible, but easy enough to test other balls.
Try a Vice Pro Soft or a Vice Pro, I did and was amazed how a ball so soft and economical could perform with my usual $40+/doz big name balls.
I guess I will just keep posting this graph every time this question comes up. The horizontal axis is clubhead speed and the graph show low compression and high compression balls for swing speeds of 85, 102 and 119 mph. No difference...so the fact that it is low compression is no issue. Now as others have mentioned, a balls dimple design and flight characteristics matter very much and that might not be a good fit for you but it won't be because it is low compression.
Cheers coach, for the record people, I moved over to the bridgestone tourb RX (after someone on these forums advised), hand on heart, I have played my best golf with these balls, I much prefer the look and squishy feel off the irons/driver of the orange wilson but I can't ignore the scores I have been getting of late and my putting is so much better now, its like the wilsons were so soft they were coming off like a powerballs on the green, I really struggled with lag put.
Just to prove I am not talking BS, I took up the game in August last year, you can see lately I am dropping. So I'm going to stick with the BS for a while.
the last round I had a meltdown on the 18th, took 9 and in that round I missed 4 1ft putts, my goal was to hit single figures in a year. I feel confident.
Wedges coming next week and just invested in a nice driving iron which I will put into play a bit more. Exciting times. I feel I can get down to about 7 and then I will hit that wall where it will get tough but until then I will enjoy the ride and feeling of progress. Good job really, I have spent a fortune on sim, balls equipment but I am seeing a return and people I am playing against are noticing it too which is good.
Where do I start...another thread with a guy who claims to be close to single digits and is already almost at Tiger swing speeds in a year of playing...why is it that I have a hard time believing this? I'll just go ahead and apologize now...I'm not at 7 yet and I've been playing for 20 years and working hard at it for almost 10, and I'm no slouch but will never reach 115 mph ss...I'm sorry but I'm very skeptical of your claims.
Where do I start...another thread with a guy who claims to be close to single digits and is already almost at Tiger swing speeds in a year of playing...why is it that I have a hard time believing this? I'll just go ahead and apologize now...I'm not at 7 yet and I've been playing for 20 years and working hard at it for almost 10, and I'm no slouch but will never reach 115 mph ss...I'm sorry but I'm very skeptical of your claims.
Club head speed has little to do with time played. The avg club head driver speed is 95, mine is over 20mph faster than that.
That is just natural ability. If you can swing 115 you can hit 325 under right conditions. its not an average but I can take 275+ off the tee most of the time even with my 1000rpm right spin. most 2nd shots are a chip in. its not rocket science.
I'll first apologize for being a jack-****. I wasn't so much directing my post at you, as just in general some of the claims on here get a little crazy. But I mean I did respond directly to you, so again...apologies.
BUT, clubhead speed and handicap (and typically time played) do correlate quite well with each other. It is of course possible for someone to have a fast clubhead speed very early in their golfing life, but it is by no means typical.
I don't have the stats in front of me, but I would guess 115 ss w driver would put you in the upper 1-2% of all golfers, and probably the upper .01-.02% of 1st year golfers. And the average golfer is supposed to shoot 100, so roughly speaking a 7 handicap might put you in the upper 10% or so of golfers...maybe upper 5%. And probably upper .1-2% of 1st year golfers. I don't have the data distribution in front of me, but I do understand statistical distributions quite well, and so I consider the above reasonable guesses. Thus, you are maybe 1 in 10,000 if your numbers are true, which is awesome for you and I'll admit makes me jealous given I'm not there yet after 20 years and never will reach those speeds, but maybe I can be forgiven for my skepticism based on the data.
Edited to add that I looked it up and my numbers are actually slightly conservative, so you are more like 1 in 100,000 to 1 in a million for male amateur golfers. So again, if your numbers are right, that is amazing but you are truly 1 in a million.
And the research on low compression balls would suggest that there really isn't that much difference if at all in low vs high compression distances, so swing away at that marshmallow!!! In theory they would compress more therefore "spring " off the clubface but apparently COR doesn't change all that much with compression.
I'm a bit beyond that but speed isn't everything. I have that speed, but I have little control over my spin rates which ruin any advantage my speed gives me.
From time to time I hit it sweet and it goes something like this.
But if you look at the shot on the GC2 already there, that is my typical flight and my high backspin and sidespin [r] generally puts me the same distance off the tee as a good player whose swinging it about 105. You should be able to see from my swing its not good but I can hack something together, usually by aiming to the left and relying on brute force to offset high backspin and side spin [R] but its something I would like to solve.
Credit goes to you and gives me more confirmation that I can be a jerk sometimes. Nice swing for having only played a year or so.
Like I said above, you are quite literally one in a million.
Good luck in the journey of getting better. I've put in 20 hard years to go from a 30+ to an 8 now, and it definitely didn't happen overnight...happened very gradually. And it also didn't go down in a straight line...it's had its peaks and valleys.
If you are already at single digits, then "just ****"...good for you!
Good luck in the journey of getting better. I've put in 20 hard years to go from a 30+ to an 8 now, and it definitely didn't happen overnight...happened very gradually. And it also didn't go down in a straight line...it's had its peaks and valleys.
If you are already at single digits, then "just ****"...good for you!
I'm not at single digits, I'm 13.7 I said I aim to be single within a year. I got about 6 months to drop 4 shots.
Its really just silly stuff which is costing me shots, I.E. today I put it 15 ft from the pin in 2 on a par 5 just off the green, then take 4 to get down.
I just got a 58 wedge so I think that will help a lot when close to the green.
I'll first apologize for being a jack-****. I wasn't so much directing my post at you, as just in general some of the claims on here get a little crazy. But I mean I did respond directly to you, so again...apologies.
I don't have the stats in front of me, but I would guess 115 ss w driver would put you in the upper 1-2% of all golfers, and probably the upper .01-.02% of 1st year golfers. And the average golfer is supposed to shoot 100, so roughly speaking a 7 handicap might put you in the upper 10% or so of golfers...maybe upper 5%. And probably upper .1-2% of 1st year golfers. I don't have the data distribution in front of me, but I do understand statistical distributions quite well, and so I consider the above reasonable guesses. Thus, you are maybe 1 in 10,000 if your numbers are true, which is awesome for you and I'll admit makes me jealous given I'm not there yet after 20 years and never will reach those speeds, but maybe I can be forgiven for my skepticism based on the data.
And the research on low compression balls would suggest that there really isn't that much difference if at all in low vs high compression distances, so swing away at that marshmallow!!! In theory they would compress more therefore "spring " off the clubface but apparently COR doesn't change all that much with compression.
Here's a link to an article with clubhead speed and handicap.
Obviously, no stat is perfect and I'm not making any statements about what he can/can't do. But statistically speaking, a 14 hcp swinging at 115 mph is a 6 sigma event. I've never cared to recall the exact percentages beyond a 3 sigma event, but needless to say he is an interesting statistical data point.
For those who find it depressing they have slower swing speeds hear this.
Swing speed does not = automatic distance. That is only true IF<< the other aspects of your swing and delivery are good. That's really hard to do.
The pro at my local shop swings 105-107 and gets 290ish yds on GC2 nearly every time and its in play.
I can swing up to 15 MPH faster than him (mostly because I come over the top) and on average I obtain LOWER distance than him and worse offline?
I have too much backspin.
I have too much side spin.
I don't hit the ball as consistent on the club face as him.
All of that is due to a bad technique.
Sure, from time to time I nail it sweet and I'm 30 yards ahead and yes then, swing speed can be as simple as MORE DISTANCE, but at the level most of us are playing at, over 18 holes, its worth very little, the only bonus is from time to time you will drive a par 4 in one and people will look at you like you invented fire and you can hit a PW 130-140 so it can make it easier, that is nice I admit, and that is something you will never do without swing speed, but golf is a game of averages.
I got beat by a 65 yr old man on the weekend off 16 because he didn't get 2 NR's due to a bad drive and I did.
I have videos of me doing 2 identical looking drives on GC2, one goes 228, the other goes 308. Same swing speed, but massive different outcomes in distance.
Under optimum player conditions every MPH in ball speed is about 3 extra yards, so if someone is 15 MPH faster than you, then in theory, they could be 3x15=45yds further than you, but there are MUCH MUCH higher gains to be obtained by being efficient. For most players, its even less than 3 yds per MPH.
controlling side spin, backspin and hitting the thing straight like i said above, I had differences of up to 80 yards.
So I was losing the equiv of 26 MPH club head speed due to bad technique.
That means if I was swinging 115 MPH, my inefficiency took me down to the equiv of swinging 89 MPH!
Like I said before, I played vs a 70+ yr old guy 2 weeks ago, I hit the par 4 in one (342 yds with a strong wind behind me), front of the green, 40 yard putt, he's 130 yards behind off the tee in middle of fairway.
I 3 putt, he hits a second shot pin high, 10 yards off green, chip to within 3 foot of the hole and makes a par too.
We left that hole with identical scores, yet 5 minutes earlier walking up the fairway the group was telling me they had never seen anyone do that. I went from hero to zero in 5 minutes /smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />. It was beyond sobering.
So don't get too bummed out about swing speeds, there are long drive guys who can swing it 150 MPH but how many of them have won a major?
No doubt getting the smash factor above 1.45 consistently (I'd say this is a reasonable target for around 10 handicap players. better players are obviously closer to 1.48-1.5) is key for driving it reasonably well (combo of distance for your swing speed and accuracy).
However, you have the advantage that the technique can be improved over time through practice. Even if you tone it down to say 110 mph, if you can hit the center of the club the ball will go pretty far.
In contrast, I think there's only so much clubhead speed someone can add once they've played the game for 5-10 years. Add that you never get younger and its an uphill battle to add significant distance (20+ yards).
I believe this (and the way the game/course setup has evolved over time) is why many instructors just want young kids to hit the **** out of the ball early on. Accuracy / course management is something that can be adjusted over time much easier than the raw speed number.
Your questions, and therefore the answers, are focused on the driver. If that's your main focus, I agree with those that say compression matters very little with the driver. But, at high CHS, relative to ball compression, it's not about the driver, it's about wedge and iron spin. You will compress balls of all compression with the driver. But with your irons and wedges, you will compress too much core, reducing spin. You will hit more greens and shoot lower scores, at your CHS, with a multi-layer urethane ball.
I disagree. It is all personal preference. My swing speed is slightly above his (Driver = 105+mph) and I have shot some of my better scores using a Callaway Supersoft. Full wedges are about 250-500 rpm less spin with a Supersoft compared to a Chromesoft X for me.
Pretty easy. Take some other balls out next time out a play a hole with a harder version or a different type all together and see if you really are losing off the tee box.
Z star all day long. Soft enough for my 105mph driver swing. Your definitely leaving yardage on the table. More importantly, ball speed.
In general, off the tee, any modern ball is going to be within a few yards of each other off the driver. TXG has tested this, and it's pretty much true. A few might launch slightly higher if that is an issue for you, but you're unlikely to pick up much ball speed and any more than 5 yards of carry off a driver. You might lose a couple of yards if you play a super soft ball an have a very high swing speed. But even then, Matt at TXG is swinging 120+ and just barely over compressing a Duo-U. For almost any normal golfer, they never have to worry about over compression. The balls are so close that off the tee, I doubt you could ever hit enough shots to say which one was longer on a course. Strike variations, variations in wind, landing spot, etc are going to so far overshadow the ball difference that you just can't tell which one is actually longer.
Now off the mid to long irons, you can actually see differences in balls. Some of them spin way less or way more off these clubs. The ball speed is almost always going to be the same, but launch and spin can move the total distance 5-10 yards pretty easy. You'll probably be able to notice this on a course.
Wedge spin is also very dependent on the ball.
So when choosing a ball, take all the ones that do what you want off the wedges. Then take those and pick the one that gives you the best launch characteristics off your mid irons. Then don't really worry about what it does off your driver.
>>I disagree. It is all personal preference. My swing speed is slightly above his (Driver = 105+mph) and I have shot some of my better scores using a Callaway Supersoft. Full wedges are about 250-500 rpm less spin with a Supersoft compared to a Chromesoft X for me.