- [Max] Hello.
- Hey.
- [Max] Hi, I'm Max.
- I'm Tracie.
- Hey Tracie.
(laughing)
- Oh my gosh.
This is so cool.
(laughing)
- Okay, so.
- How are these moments of
feeling like a complete chump?
(suspenseful music)
What if she stands us up?
- It's possible.
- That would be something.
- Is that her?
(dramatic music)
That's her, right?
(laughing)
- Hello.
- Hi.
- How you doing?
- I'm good, how are you?
- Good to meet you.
- Nice to meet you.
- Nev.
Max.
- I'm Max.
- Hello.
- Nice to meet you.
- Nice to meet you.
Hi.
- Tracie, who you know.
- It's nice to see you.
- Did you ever think this
kind of thing would happen?
- No, not at all.
- So, when you created Reese,
was the plan to give her cancer
and kill her immediately?
- No, it wasn't, that was,
I decided to do that after
I realized it got too far.
- Whose funeral was that?
- My cousin's.
- [Tracie] So your cousin died?
- Yeah.
- You went to your cousin's
funeral and filmed it.
What?
(dramatic music)
- For me the real question
is, what kind of discussions
have come up as a result of the fact
that you guys live in the same city?
- There's been multiple
times where she's been close,
and then it's just not happened.
She actually had her friend
drive by my house one night,
and she called me after the fact
and said she left a note on my jeep.
- Well what did the note say?
- Said like, I can't wait to
see you tomorrow, Boo Bear.
She's even taken pictures
of the outside of the work.
- And sent them to you?
- And sent them to me.
- That's creepy and kind of stalker-ish.
- [Mike] Yeah, it's scary at times.
In a sense, I was being watched.
- You have a stalker.
- [Mike] It's.
- You've probably met this person.
(dramatic music)
Why are you torturing yourself?
- How can I just leave
somebody who I'm that tied to?
I love who she is, and I can't break free
of the hold she has on me.
- [Max] You okay?
- Yeah.
(suspenseful music)
- Nice to meet you.
- Nice to meet you, too.
- Nev.
- Nice to meet you, Markie.
Wow.
- [Nev] You're very excited.
- I'm very, very excited.
I'm trying not to like jump into her arms
and plow her down to the floor.
(laughing)
- That's not exactly the
reaction that I expected.
- [Max] Yeah, if anything,
we've been kind of ready for--
- The worst?
- I mean, look, we all
wanna be excited, obviously,
but I just wanna get some
things out of the way first.
- Of course.
- Well if you guys wanna go sit down
at that table in the shade.
- So okay, from what we
gathered from Blaire's story was
that you didn't come to New York,
and then she got a strange phone call
from you like a couple days afterwards,
saying that you were in
a hospital of some kind
and that you weren't gonna come
and you were still in love
with your ex girlfriend,
and that it was over.
- I never got answers,
I never got reasons,
and that's all I want is why?
- So, I was 17, and the man
pretty much didn't kidnap me.
I went on my own.
- What, what?
- He persuaded me to go with him
because of issues that would
happen in New York that he saw.
- He saw issues, how could he?
I don't get this.
- [Nev] Is he an ex of yours?
- No.
- So I don't know who, just he?
- It's a very private situation.
I can't really let out names.
What had happened was I had
a dream I went to New York
and I died, and I told
you about the dream,
and he told me that if I
didn't go and repent my sins
I guess, I don't know, he
didn't make it clear, but
he told me pretty much if
I didn't confess everything
to him, I would die in New York,
and so that pushed me
to the limit as to where
I felt like I needed to go for
you, for me, for my family,
so I could stay alive.
- Where were you, were you like far away
in the middle of no where?
- I was up in the mountains.
- Why does this person have
so much influence over you?
- He was a close, personal friend.
- You don't think you could
have told this guy you need
to let me know that you're not coming?
- No, because he didn't
want to talk to you,
he didn't want anything to do with you.
- You couldn't talk to me?
- It's a terrible story, and I'm sorry
that I still don't, I don't--
- Fully understand.
- I don't understand it.
- I know this probably
feels like an interrogation,
I don't want it to, but,
does it come as a surprise
that you have a reputation
for not telling the truth?
- No, because I have had
people in my past say
that I have a lying problem,
but I do try my best not to lie to Blaire.
- But you still do it.
- I try not to.
- [Nev] Uh oh, wait a second.
(dramatic music)
- The (beeping) kinda (beeping).
- [Nev] I don't know what this is.
(dramatic music)
- I thought this ain't the (beeping).
(clapping)
(beeping) Is this?
- Hey man, wanna chill out a second?
- Shh.
- Excuse me.
- The (beeping) is man.
- Don't touch me.
- You better back up, man.
- Don't touch me.
- Better back up.
- The (beeping) kinda (beeping) is this?
- You better chill out, man.
- What the (beeping) kinda
(beeping) is this?, man?
- We're talking.
Him and I are talking.
- You (beeping), you a (beeping).
- Hold on a second.
- He and I are talking.
I can tell you one thing right now, buddy,
one thing you're gonna
like, you're gonna learn
to love it too.
- The hell are you talking about dude?
- I'm gonna be the one
wearing the pants in this,
you understand that?
- The (beeping) kinda (beeping) is this?
- [Nev] You're being unreasonable.
- Straight up, the (beeping)
kinda (beeping) is this?
- I'm just asking you to take
it down a couple notches.
- Hey.
- You brought a lot of attitude.
- By the way, lot of attitude
last night, thanks a lot,
really felt it too, you and
I, got to know you better.
I loved it, but I tell you what,
you and I could do that later.
Come here, we're gonna talk, you and I.
- What the (beeping)?
We ain't got (beeping),
we done talking (beeping).
- Are you kidding me?
You could still be my chocolate kiss too,
you don't forget about that, baby.
- Come on.
- What the (beeping)
kinda (beeping) is that?
- Do you know this guy?
- No, I don't know this (beeping).
- [Max] Are you Jess?
- Yeah, I'm Jess.
- [Max] You're Jess?
- Yeah.
- Man, (beeping) what man?
(dramatic music)
- I mean this, that, there.
(beeping)
That's what I had.
- What the (beeping) kinda
(beeping) is that man?
Ah hell no, (beeping) that.
- Not everything is as it seems.
Not everything you see
or want it to be can
be exactly what you want it to be,
and I am living proof
of that and I felt that,
and I felt the necessity
to put myself out there.
- This (beeping) is (beeping) crazy.
(dramatic music)
- [Nev] Oh my god.
(dramatic music)
- Hey bro, how's it going?
My name's Kelsey.
I'm Adam the gambler.
- Whoa.
(laughing)
- [John] So what's your end game here?
- Just to have fun with you man.
That was it, you know, it
was a game, it's over now.
- So this was all just fun and games?
- Yeah, really it is, yeah.
- Is there something else more meaningful
that you think you proved with this?
- No, there's no deeper
meaning to any of this.
- Whose pictures are you using?
(laughing)
- Actually, a girl I
knew from high school.
- Do you have a job?
Are you in school?
- Yeah, this is like my job right now.
I'll go here, I time the jackpot,
so I'll just do whatever
I want on my phone,
time the jackpot, win about 60 bucks
for the night, go home.
- How do you know you're
gonna win the jackpot?
- I have an algorithm you
see, I count the number
of people in here, right?
And then I have like all
the times on my phone,
I can even show you, I have all the times
that they've ever gone off.
- He's rigged.
- Yeah.
In between jack pots, there's
like a transition period
where you're waiting for
the thing, I log in here,
pretend to be Kelsey, talk to him a while.
It's just something to
do to pass the time.
- Did you create that psychology group
to lure people in to
then, like, mess with them
and carry on fake relationships with?
- You know, I took advantage of the fact
that I had this group up,
yeah, no let's add this other
account of mine in there and let's
see who we can mess with, you know?
- [Nev] How many people do
you think you've catfished?
- I would say about maybe
30, 40, around there.
It's interesting to me and fun.
- Is your relationship
with Ellie something
that you even care about?
- [Max] Or are you just using her?
- Oh no, I care about Ellie.
You know, she is my
girlfriend, it's not a cover up
or anything like that, I have
genuine feelings for her.
- I've talked to Ellie before, sweet girl,
amazing girl, what in this (beeping) world
makes you think you're
getting anywhere with that?
- I can justify anything.
I can justify anything.
- So how'd you like my (beeping) pic?
- That was uh, it's interesting, thank you
for sending it to me, I really
want that on my computer.
- You (beeping) yourself
off to this (beeping)?
(laughing)
- No, I deleted it quickly after.
- Did you just wake up this morning
and say, you know what?
I wanna play a bad guy on TV, I just wanna
be the worst version of
myself that I can be,
is that what you decided?
- Yeah, that was what it, that's.
- Is this really who you are right now?
- This is really who I am.
I'm the joker.
- I mean--
- This is the kind of loser
that gives our show a bad name.
I mean do we really sitting here
and giving him any air time?
- I'm the king of catfishes, right?
- No you're not.
- I am, I'm the king catfish.
- [Nev] You're really not.
- I am.
- I'm done here, I'm done.
I'm done.
(laughing)
- Hi, Tracey, right?
- Yeah.
- [Nev] How you doing?
- Good.
- Are you kidding me?
- So I'm here with someone
you might recognize.
(dramatic music)
- Oh my gosh, ew.
(laughing)
I don't like her, she stole
all of Jacqueline Linkwood's friends.
- Did she just say I stole
Jacqueline Linkwood's stuff.
- She said you stole
Jacqueline Linkwood's friends.
- So I heard that correctly.
- I think it'd be good if
we all came in to talk.
- Okay fine, she can come in.
- [Nev] Why don't you guys come in.
(dramatic music)
- [Max] Hello.
- Hi.
- Hi, I'm Max.
- I'm Tracey.
- Hey Tracey.
(laughing)
Oh my gosh.
This is so cool.
(laughing)
- Okay, so, you seem relatively chipper.
- Yeah, I'm always cheerful.
It's just my personality.
- Are you putting on an act right now?
- No, this is really me.
- This is really you?
- This is really me when I'm me.
I'm just really energetic,
I work with kids, so.
- Like in a daycare?
- Yeah.
- Okay.
- They love me so much,
they're like my best friends.
They're like my little
puppies, they're so cute.
- Obviously you understand why we're here.
You admitted that you
created this profile,
so we were hoping to hear a
little bit more about that.
- I was bored with my life, so
I wanted to be someone else.
- Right.
- Like the whole Jacqueline
Linkwood thing was like Miley
and Hannah, you know, Tracey by day.
On the internet, I was
Jacqueline by night.
- Is that Hannah Montana,
is that how it works?
- Yeah, that's how I like did everything.
Like I come home from
school, bang I'm Jacqueline,
not Tracey anymore.
- How old were you when
you started doing that?
- I was 14, in middle school.
- [Nev] So now you're about 20?
- 20 today.
- 20 today, oh that's right,
that's right your birthday.
- What could you do as Jacqueline
that you couldn't do as Tracey?
- Oh my gosh, um, I don't
know, as Jacqueline,
I could talk to anyone I wanted
and like bully people and stuff.
It all comes back to
when people bullied me,
so like I have to bully other
people too to get revenge.
- But why take out what people do to you
on other people who
didn't do anything to you?
- Because they bullied me too.
People, they're like
you're fake, you're fake.
- But you were fake.
- But you were fake.
- But they didn't know that.
- A lot of people don't like Falesha
because they associate her
with your (beeping) up profile.
- I really don't like Falesha,
I think she deserves it.
She thinks she a model and
she thinks she's all that.
I'm still mad at her.
Jacqueline is popular, she
had all that popularity
and Falesha ruined it, that's
why I don't really like her.
- Should I apologize for ruining that?
Because I'm sincerely sorry.
- Jacqueline was like a real person.
She wasn't a real person,
I was the real person.
(laughing)
- Do you take drugs?
- I am not on drugs, I never
took a drug in my life.
I'm just naturally happy and hyper.
- Just out of curiosity, I was wondering
why you seem so proud of this?
- Because like, I created
Jacqueline, and I'm proud
of creating her, I'm proud of it.
It really helped me.
When I got to bully people
online, I felt so tough.
- And what if someone you cyber
bullied killed themselves?
- Really?
- Yeah, really.
- I wouldn't cry, would
you want me to cry?
It's not my fault they killed themselves.
They made that choice themselves,
so it's their fault, not mine.
- Maybe people really did that
because you told them to, that could've
been the trigger, that doesn't bother you?
- It does not bother
me, it's not my fault.
I did not hold a gun to their
head saying go kill yourself.
- Yeah but some people that
have really low self-esteem--
- Well I have a high self-esteem.
- This is relatively pointless,
what's going on right here.
- Am I done with her?
- Yeah, I mean, we're done for
now, we're all done for now.
- All right, good.
Falesha, are you gonna say happy birthday?
(laughing)
That was so much fun.
- Oh my gosh.
(dramatic music)
Are you Courtney?
- Of course I am.
- Wow, hi.
- Hi.
- Nev.
- Nev, you have your dad's eyes.
(laughing)
You so have your dad's eyes.
Hi honey.
- Are you telling the truth?
- Of course I am.
Oh, of course I am, I would
never, ever make something up
like this that could be so you know,
potentially hurtful,
I just, I knew that the situation was so
strange.
You know, the more I talked with your dad,
the more I realized, something good has
to come out of this, and I wanted
to be able to give you that peace of mind.
I wanted to be able to give
you maybe some closure.
- There's so much I
wanna talk to you about.
- Me too.
It was so overwhelming for
me too for the longest time,
because I know the
situation that he was in,
and I know everything that happened.
- How did you know about that?
- He told me.
He went through the story.
It was not something
that Franky really wanted
to happen, I know that
he feels so much regret,
and he struggles with the fact that
his daughters do forgive him,
because he doesn't even think he
deserves forgiveness himself.
- So you never met him in real
life, even though you grew
up in Ohio, you never crossed
paths with him in Kentucky?
- No, no I've never, I
don't have any connection
with him whatsoever.
- And did you read about this, you know,
story when it happened?
- No, this was something that happened
in a small town in Kentucky,
and it just, there was
no reason for make it all the way
up to northeastern Ohio news.
And to be honest with
you, I never even knew
that I had this ability, I
mean, it was so overwhelming
for me too for the longest time.
When he first showed up, I
remember I was in my room,
and I was focused very much on
writing that I was working
on, and I actually fell asleep
at my laptop and it was just a little,
couple hours later maybe,
I woke up and I remember
opening my eyes and I
could see out of the corner
of my eye but I didn't wanna look,
but there was a figure
at the side of my bed,
and right then and there I
could pick up the feelings.
He was also confused,
he was also very scared.
He did not realize how
he had gotten there.
Did not know why, and
all I could think of was,
well, he must need help.
- I assume once he told you his name,
you went on the internet
and looked him up?
- Absolutely, did I get on on Google
to confirm, am I crazy?
Did this person and
his story really exist?
Because believe me, I was
just as skeptical, completely.
There was quite a while
when I actually thought
what if I'm insane, what
if I'm like schizophrenic?
What if I'm losing it?
- Since this started, have
you gone to any doctors
to see if perhaps you might
have a medical condition
like a schizophrenia?
- Yeah, absolutely.
I went to see a doctor
and I don't have any sort
of personality disorder, I
don't have schizophrenia,
I don't have any of the mental illnesses.
So it took me a long time
before I really realized,
no, he is real, and I can
hear him, and I can see him.
