You're assuming I care whether there's a Kroger by you. I inherited stock in the company, and I'll plug it anytime, anywhere if for no other reason than a shameless attempt to make myself richer.

Well you don't get rich, owning stock. You get rich knowing when to buy and sell it, Kroger is a safe stock, you're not going to lose your shirt nor are you going to be dripping in diamonds, it's a hold at best. Since June of 2000 it's up $4 a share, that doesn't keep pace with inflation. If it hit's $32, sell it and buy growth Mutual Funds and put it in a ROTH IRA, diversify your holding, never keep all your eggs in one basket.

There might be a possible tax benefit in giving a discount to those on food stamps. I know up here, if you give away any kind of goods, to charity or a store promotion, you get to write off the full retail value, including your markup. Could be that the tax savings of giving a 20% discount on something that cost you considerably less to buy might possibly cancel out the loss. They might also have some sort of arrangement to pass the cost on to their suppliers, who likewise get to write off more than the discount would actually cost them. I know nothing of the tax system in Kentucky, so this is just speculation.

Someone has to be the angry white man, it's apathy and spinelessness that has got us here.

It's grocery stores that get write-offs and business providing any discounts. Your tax dollars have nothing to do with this; they would still find a way to get write-offs with or without discounts or specialized programs.

Would it make you feel better, however, if a single mother or disabled person who needs assistance were to stop getting it?

Would it make you feel better if billion dollar corporations could just shred money and get a write off rather than using any of it for the needy?

Maybe grocery stores and other retailers should stop senior discounts for people on fixed incomes whose cost of living increases to their benefits are in no way keeping step with inflation while increasing prescription costs are cutting back on what they have available to spend on food. Would that make you feel better?

I kind of doubt any of those would make you feel better. I rather doubt that if you knew a family that needed assistance because of a bad situation that you would refuse to help them.

When I lost most everything and was without work, it was suggested, quite strongly, that I try to get food stamps. I didn't. I'm not too good for them or anything else, but I am a single male without tiedowns who is physically capable of working.

There are quite a few people because of unfortunate situations, family responsibilities, physically disabled, or otherwise, who are not so fortunate to be able to work and need some kind of assistance. If a store provides someone in need with a discount (certainly not for purely altruistic reasons), especially in a time when the cost of living is far outpacing any increases in benefits, that's not such a bad thing to me.

If that sounds spineless to you, then how does it sound when someone in their white bread world complains about someone in need getting assistance?

Someone has to be the angry white man, it's apathy and spinelessness that has got us here.

My father would have agreed with that, but not publicly, and I mean a long time ago. For many years before he died in 1992, he could not speak well, nor was he able or compelled to express such opinions. The apple falls not far from the tree, and I'm well for the moment, so I can relate to what you write. Yet, I do not agree. We've not all been apathetic nor spineless. Us white boys are just not top dog anymore.

You're assuming I care whether there's a Kroger by you. I inherited stock in the company, and I'll plug it anytime, anywhere if for no other reason than a shameless attempt to make myself richer.

Well you don't get rich, owning stock. You get rich knowing when to buy and sell it, Kroger is a safe stock, you're not going to lose your shirt nor are you going to be dripping in diamonds, it's a hold at best. Since June of 2000 it's up $4 a share, that doesn't keep pace with inflation. If it hit's $32, sell it and buy growth Mutual Funds and put it in a ROTH IRA, diversify your holding, never keep all your eggs in one basket.

Well my brother would suggest "dollar cost averaging" which has done real well for me. I don't sell stock at all, but I do buy, I didn't realize I was still logged in... at me

There might be a possible tax benefit in giving a discount to those on food stamps. I know up here, if you give away any kind of goods, to charity or a store promotion, you get to write off the full retail value, including your markup. Could be that the tax savings of giving a 20% discount on something that cost you considerably less to buy might possibly cancel out the loss. They might also have some sort of arrangement to pass the cost on to their suppliers, who likewise get to write off more than the discount would actually cost them. I know nothing of the tax system in Kentucky, so this is just speculation.

Kentucky doesn't tax food, but they do tax revenue (gross profits) however any tax benefit one person (or company) gets is made up by another. Food stores have not of the lowest profit margins of any (profitable) business at about 1.5%.

It's grocery stores that get write-offs and business providing any discounts. Your tax dollars have nothing to do with this; they would still find a way to get write-offs with or without discounts or specialized programs.

Tax dollars have nothing do to with food stamps, really? I did not know that.If the cash payer buys a gallon of milk for $5 and the food stamper pays $4, what's wrong with both paying $4.50? Can every person with cash better afford paying more, simply because they're not on food stamps? What about those right above the line, they make just a tad to much to get food stamps, OR as in your case didn't want them, could you better afford the $1 without government assistants than you would have with it? Would a reduction of 10% in your food bill not help you by splitting the 20%?

But Robin Hood is a live and well take from those that did something with their life and give it those with excuses.

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Would it make you feel better, however, if a single mother or disabled person who needs assistance were to stop getting it?

Oh yes, single moms, disabled people and the elderly the classic liberal argument, when all else fails throw the single mom, disabled and elderly at the heartless evil Republicans don't you know we're immune to that argument, it's worn out.

I have no problem with those that need TEMPORARY help getting it. But when you buy your food with government money and put it in your Lexus, I've got a problem with that. Get your priorities straight. There are people on food stamps that need help and there are as many on them that are milking the system.Welfare and food stamps SHOULD be a hand up, not a hand out.

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Would it make you feel better if billion dollar corporations could just shred money and get a write off rather than using any of it for the needy?Maybe grocery stores and other retailers should stop senior discounts for people on fixed incomes whose cost of living increases to their benefits are in no way keeping step with inflation while increasing prescription costs are cutting back on what they have available to spend on food. Would that make you feel better?

The store in question is not a billion dollar corporation, be that as it may any corporation first obligation is to the share holder not the consumer, sad but true. Now I know that flies in the face of what the left believes but it's called capitalism. To make money to invest money to make more money and as added benefit you provide jobs and inject those monies into the economy and add revenue to the taxable base. Corporate taxes which the US has some of the highest in the world, do nothing more than move money off shore and jobs over seas

Corporation have no problem finding right offs, as corporation do not pay taxes, they merely pass them on to the end consumer. (which is the lunacy of the windfall profit tax)Yes the old people eating cat food, most old people I know could buy and sell most people over and over, they aren't broke and those with no money are victims of their life long poor money management. You are given at least 50 years to save and build a savings, plan for the future and insure you have money to live on in old age.

Poor planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine.

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I kind of doubt any of those would make you feel better. I rather doubt that if you knew a family that needed assistance because of a bad situation that you would refuse to help them.

No, I wouldn't and haven't refused to help those in need. What I will not do is enable those that want to remain dependent.

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When I lost most everything and was without work, it was suggested, quite strongly, that I try to get food stamps. I didn't. I'm not too good for them or anything else, but I am a single male without tiedowns who is physically capable of working.

Menard there is nothing wrong with a hand up, I've said it a 1000 times. It's a the hand out I don't like, there is a difference. Sometimes people need help, and help should be there for them. When it becomes a generational way of life it's a problem. The system is screwed there are those the want assistances and will work twice as hard to keep it as they would have to if they got off it.I'm self employed and can lose it all at anytime, everyday I don't know where my next paycheck is coming from, where the next job is coming from, and everyday I have to absorb more and more increased cost of supplies to remain competitive. Everyday I have get out there and find more and more work just to stay level. So why I may see in increase in the gross the net goes down just to stay in business. Whoopty-do that's just the way it is, I deal with it and adapt and overcome, most people do.

The only people is this world that have never failed, have never tired.

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There are quite a few people because of unfortunate situations, family responsibilities, physically disabled, or otherwise, who are not so fortunate to be able to work and need some kind of assistance. If a store provides someone in need with a discount (certainly not for purely altruistic reasons), especially in a time when the cost of living is far outpacing any increases in benefits, that's not such a bad thing to me.

Define physically disabled? If a guy with no legs can work at True Value, or a mongoloid clean tables at Wendy's then define disabled. There are the disabled and the unwilling. Two words, Steven Hawkins and for those that do not have a genius IQ there are sheltered workshops. Now before you go having a cow I have no problem help those that are doing all they are CAPABLE of to help themselves. There is a difference between those that are doing all they are capable of and those that are just flat out lazy. No I'm not saying everyone on food stamps, section 8 and welfare are lazy, far from it. But if you enable able bodied people to do nothing and get paid for it, many will take it. Pride is fleeting.

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If that sounds spineless to you, then how does it sound when someone in their white bread world complains about someone in need getting assistance?

Once again you missed the point.

White bread world ... right ... let me polish off my silver spoon. I've never lived on rice 3 meals a day, didn't have money for gas or repairs, went without electricity, phone, water or even a place to stay and cable, cable was for the rich folks ... right? Wait a minute, I did do that and I didn't like it so I got a education, got job, saved up and made my own damn bread instead of taking it from others. So I have painfully little sympathy for 'I can't' when what they mean is 'I won't.'Hunger is a hell of a motivator.

I'm all for charity and I give plenty, $1000's every year, but the difference is simple I'd prefer to decide who I give my money to as opposed to the government taking it from me and divvying it up on my so call behalf. Check out the book, "Who really cares?" it out lines how the evil conservatives give 30% more to charity every year than the deeply caring liberals.

Someone has to be the angry white man, it's apathy and spinelessness that has got us here.

My father would have agreed with that, but not publicly, and I mean a long time ago. For many years before he died in 1992, he could not speak well, nor was he able or compelled to express such opinions. The apple falls not far from the tree, and I'm well for the moment, so I can relate to what you write. Yet, I do not agree. We've not all been apathetic nor spineless. Us white boys are just not top dog anymore.

What's with this all saints day game you are playing ...

Anyway it's not black, white, red, yellow, man, women, straight, gay ... it's about haven't enough self pride to want to make your own way in the world and not have to ride on the coat tails of others.

I see able body people setting around fully able to work complaining they can't find a job and I just drove past 20 "help wanted" signs on businesses. They need to wake and realize that their not going to start out like as a CEO making $200K a year, you have to crawl before you walk, you have to walk before the run.One of my friends started working at Wendy's in high school, that was 25 years ago he is now a North American manager making well into the 6 digits living the good life, and he started washing trays and mopping floors.My uncle just retired from RJ Reynolds as a VP, he started sweeping floors of the warehouse straight out of the military.

Fact are people don't want to pay their dues anymore, they feel they'll owed something ... well news flash, the world owes you nothing but opportunity and it's there in abundance.

It's not a game. Who doesn't know it's me? I'm sharing InYourRear's punishment of 10 days banishment. Let me tell you know it's much more work for Menard-type contributors, as I have tried to be, having to identify, and label, and verify with indiscernible text for each posting... it's a lot less fun!! It's punishment. Think of it as penance.

Anyway it's not black, white, red, yellow, man, women, straight, gay ... it's about haven't enough self pride to want to make your own way in the world and not have to ride on the coat tails of others.

I see able body people setting around fully able to work complaining they can't find a job and I just drove past 20 "help wanted" signs on businesses. They need to wake and realize that their not going to start out like as a CEO making $200K a year, you have to crawl before you walk, you have to walk before the run.One of my friends started working at Wendy's in high school, that was 25 years ago he is now a North American manager making well into the 6 digits living the good life, and he started washing trays and mopping floors.My uncle just retired from RJ Reynolds as a VP, he started sweeping floors of the warehouse straight out of the military.

Fact are people don't want to pay their dues anymore, they feel they'll owed something ... well news flash, the world owes you nothing but opportunity and it's there in abundance.

You definitely need an editor. "...haven't enough self pride...?" Well, I guess we know what you mean. I don't see your point, but don't disagree with anything you wrote.

I see able body people setting around fully able to work complaining they can't find a job and I just drove past 20 "help wanted" signs on businesses. They need to wake and realize that their not going to start out like as a CEO making $200K a year, you have to crawl before you walk, you have to walk before the run.One of my friends started working at Wendy's in high school, that was 25 years ago he is now a North American manager making well into the 6 digits living the good life, and he started washing trays and mopping floors.My uncle just retired from RJ Reynolds as a VP, he started sweeping floors of the warehouse straight out of the military.

Fact are people don't want to pay their dues anymore, they feel they'll owed something ... well news flash, the world owes you nothing but opportunity and it's there in abundance.

Perhaps you need the experience of going out and looking for work again after having been dragged down in the middle of life. You're not speaking from experience, but opinion.

I am in my forties. I quite literally pounded on doors to get my first job again; over 60 resumes and applications later. A lot of businesses want to hire someone able-bodied, and with a future ahead of them. I applied at several places that ended hiring someone just out of high school.

Of course, I never had that problem when I was young and just starting out in the job market.

A friend of mine basically told me I was full of s**t and put me in touch with the HR department where he works. He shut up about it because as soon as they found out how old I was, they nixed my application.

If I were someone applying for management or some professional position and something to bring to the table, then that would be different, but someone having to look into an entry level position is going to find that the designed age range for entry level is young.

Yes, there are definitely companies that will hire someone in their forties, but they are fewer and far between and just to get a foot in the door involves a lot more walking and talking than it would if you were ripe and out of school or out of the military.

My friend thought he knew the answers; having the same job for years moving into it from another job in the same field that he got through the college where he took classes in for that field. He even had a bad day and took it out on me with liberal use of 'bum' and several other words I shall not repeat (it is quite amazing what people, even friends and family, will do to you when they look upon you as basically homeless).

Falling down and getting up is a lot more work as you get older. This is not the same place it was when you took a help wanted sign out of a window, handed it to the storekeep, introduced yourself and got hired. Companies use various methods to profile people for potential employment. Among those considerations are age and recent experience (like the past year or two).

Despite my career as a photographer which I gave up (I thought of it as putting it on hold at the time) to take care of my mother, or my previous experience in management and sale, none of that mattered in a job market only looking for recent experience.

I have work now and due to staying with it for a while I have been able to get additional work by having recent experience. Interestingly, the only managers who have hired me are my age or older.

I can only tell you of my experience; but I can tell you that your stories of someone coming out of the military or school years ago and starting fresh is nothing but bull. It's a hard road to come back from a fall, and a lot of people out there, for one reason or another, are trying to do just that.

I'd give you karma for pulling yourself up by your bootstraps and turning it around, but alas I can't.

I didn't survive for karma or to have a story to tell for an at-a-boy pat on the back. I survived because I didn't like the alternative.

BTW... (I'll bet you just never tire of that)

Why you could have had housing, food, money and all it would have cost you was your pride.

Quite frankly, that's a slap in the face, but I don't (hopefully) think you meant it that way.

Things are not easy to acquire, services or otherwise, but peoples' opinions are.

There are qualifications, despite what you think, for getting these services. Being able-bodied without dependents does not qualify you for a lot. Being someone's caregiver is not considered a reason for not having been able to keep a regular job. Taking care of someone becomes progressively more difficult as the disease itself progresses, mentally and physically, and even trying to go out for an hour or so you return home to a bloody nose, or worse from falls, confusion and crying, or even having to put out a fire.

There's a smugness in looking down on someone without any idea of what they have been through or what they are going through. The people you presume are nothing more than bums that will be good upstanding citizens if they just follow your miracle advice based on cute little stories from years ago, many of them are probably going through a lot just to keep up.

Just my two cents worth, and with inflation, I doubt it's worth anything.

Edited to add: I have no opinion on food stamps either way; I know they get abused but it does help some folks who need it and I just hope there are far more cases wehre it was used wisely rather than cases where they were abused.

As someone who's damn near homeless myself, I can totally relate. I've been through collage, have 10+ years of XP in my field, have done a plethora of other types of jobs from factory work to farming help, to hanging gutters, to libraries, to shipping and receiving jobs but none of it is helping land anything right now (or within the last year really)and I'm having trouble even affording the weekly interviews over the last month. It's a numbers game; get calls from the temp recruiters, they talk you all up, you go interview, all 8 temp recruiters trying to submit ya for the same job where 50+ people applied, ya get selected in the top 5 but are always somehow out-experienced by one other person and results in no job and a waste of all that money. I've been through this cycle so many times that I'm so used to interviews that I'm not even nervous anymore.

So I've basically about gave up on my career, something I do very well and have had great reviews even recently, but there just aren't enough of those jobs for it to matter. I've taken many courses on resumes and interviewing, etc., -got great reviews on my prior projects, was just told my references were outstanding...it's just that my job almost doesn't exist anymore...few and far between they are and there's too many out-of work people competing for the same thing. So I figure it's time to start over and take yet another 60% pay cut and find a new career.

So I've resorted to applying at everything imaginable...mostly you have to apply at some dumb terminal computer where you don't even get to "meet" anyone. I've applied at McDonalds, Meijers, Kroger, Walmart, Wendy's, Arby's...etc,. I would have applied to the local factory like I used to when I was younger and looking for work but they moved to Mexico. It's been six months or more since I first started applying at fast food and surprisingly, I haven't heard a word. I've even dumbed down my applications, job titles, and skewed the amounts I used to make as to not look so intimidating. Hell I have at least 3 customized resumes for different types of jobs, depending on what I'm applying for.

I just don't know what I'm doing wrong. I haven't resorted to any type of assistance but I'm getting really worried. I'm behind in all my bills for once (not too bad yet but I anticipate more worry if I don't find a job soon). I am more worried about my family; I have a child with medical issues and it's hard to be able to pay child support let alone medical when I can't even support myself. I can't move too far away from my child either, so up and moving out of state isn't an option even if I could afford it.

Still, I have never asked for a hand out from anyone...but I really don't know how long I can survive like this. I was lucky enough to find a contract job in the last year that lasted a whole 3 months ...not enough to qualify for unemployment. Luckily I have friends who let me bounce around from place to place, circling 3 metro areas and trying for jobs in all of those places.

Anyway, the job market sucks and sometimes it's now always our fault. On my way to yet another job interview for a job that lasts a whole year (big improvement over the 3 monther at least). I'm sorry to rant but I can't help but feel like it's a waste of time.

Although by the time I get to the actual interview I will be much more optimistic.

Edited to Add: just got back from said interview. It felt like it went pretty well but I've felt like that before. They interviewed three people just today for said position. At any rate, I should know by tomorrow...so that's two good possible jobs I'm awaiting feedback. Wish me luck. Once I'm working again I can focus on my movie reviews once again!

Okay, I've read through everyone's arguments so I'm going to throw my own ramblings in here in a way as unbiased as I can make them. Foodstamps help people who need them. There are people who abuse them and those people are stupid. There are also people like Menard who get shot down later in life when it's going to be almost impossible to build yourself up into a high paying position, however, some have the dignity to refuse food stamps and still manage a decent living . It is unfair that stores give discounts to people with foodstamps and take it out on more "well to do" customers. But considering that there are people that seriously need them it is almost necessary. Anyhoo, I suppose that the best we can do is track down people who abuse food stamps and kick them in the .

I've said it already but I will again, I know very little on the subject and am quite frankly full of sh!t.

Perhaps you need the experience of going out and looking for work again after having been dragged down in the middle of life. You're not speaking from experience, but opinion.

I'm out looking for work everyday, but something I learned early on is you don't make money working for somebody else.

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Falling down and getting up is a lot more work as you get older. This is not the same place it was when you took a help wanted sign out of a window, handed it to the storekeep, introduced yourself and got hired. Companies use various methods to profile people for potential employment. Among those considerations are age and recent experience (like the past year or two).

Sure it's work no one said life is fair, but I've had plenty on friends in these in their 40's, 50's and 60's suddenly find them out of work that have found other jobs. Did they get hired the first place they went? No, but they found one often it a unrelated field.

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I can only tell you of my experience; but I can tell you that your stories of someone coming out of the military or school years ago and starting fresh is nothing but bull. It's a hard road to come back from a fall, and a lot of people out there, for one reason or another, are trying to do just that.

And for every sob story there is a story of success. You can go through life with the glass half empty of half full. My mother-in-law who moved from FL to TN is in her late 60s, having not worked outside the home in years, found a job in fairly short order, hired by a women younger than her. Was she just lucky or was she better at job interviews? Who know, point is she found a job quickly in her 60's after being out of work for years.

If I needed someone to say "You want fries with that?" I would, if I needed them to rough in the electrical on a house I wouldn't. The jobs posted were all fast food, they were about 20, so they met your idea demographics to a tee, young job seeker.

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Quite frankly, that's a slap in the face, but I don't (hopefully) think you meant it that way.

Nope it wasn't a slap, but I think you'd admit that there is pride in doing for yourself, whereas you sacrifice some of that pride by not.

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There's a smugness in looking down on someone without any idea of what they have been through or what they are going through. The people you presume are nothing more than bums that will be good upstanding citizens if they just follow your miracle advice based on cute little stories from years ago, many of them are probably going through a lot just to keep up.

It's not miracle advice, it's common sense, which is not so common.

Most of us have a hard luck story to tell, the question is how do you use that story? Is it a story of "what was" or "why is"? It's far from smugness. You story Menard is "what was" you didn't use it as a "why is" choices in life have to be made.

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You definitely need an editor. "...haven't enough self pride...?" Well, I guess we know what you mean. I don't see your point, but don't disagree with anything you wrote.

I find you nit pick people grammar or spelling when you want to appear superior, but that's okay I like you anyway ... hell I even like Menard.

So I need a editor, maybe I'll hire one ... provided they're young.

So you don't agree that people need to pay their dues, that they're not going to start out as a CEO? You don't agree folks need to crawl before you walk? Interesting, well I guess you started at the top, that is truly unique. Consider yourself fortunate.

You definitely need an editor. "...haven't enough self pride...?" Well, I guess we know what you mean. I don't see your point, but don't disagree with anything you wrote.

I find you nit pick people grammar or spelling when you want to appear superior, but that's okay I like you anyway ... hell I even like Menard.So I need a editor, maybe I'll hire one ... provided they're young.So you don't agree that people need to pay their dues, that they're not going to start out as a CEO? You don't agree folks need to crawl before you walk? Interesting, well I guess you started at the top, that is truly unique. Consider yourself fortunate.

Now who's being paranoid? I wrote I didn't disagree with you. And, hey, Cheezee, I was not trying to "appear superior" and in fact I think that comment shows your own sense of superiority. I just noticed you have alot of interesting typos in your postings, that sometimes are contrary to what you want to write (like in the pm you sent me about a week ago where you wrote: "I just read that thread and honestly I was completely aware..." Of course you meant completely unaware. My comments weren't meant to challenge you, so lighten up.

Most of us have a hard luck story to tell, the question is how do you use that story? Is it a story of "what was" or "why is"? It's far from smugness. You story Menard is "what was" you didn't use it as a "why is" choices in life have to be made.

OK, Cheeze, I don't want to pick on your writing either, but I just want to clarify this point. The point here is that Menard told his story of hardship as a basic account of events and not as a complaint that the world is conspiring to screw him over. Menard's problems are valid, and he has busted his ass to get by, rather than using them as an excuse to give up. You were, therefore, not complaining about him. Is that the point? If it is, I agree. That is a very important distinction.

And I also agree with Cheeze that being self-employed is no cup of tea. I much prefer a job where maintaining a steady flow of revenue and balancing the books are somebody else's problem. I wouldn't enjoy the unpredictability.