<p>There is always an inherent way to control the transaction. Try to create it, if you don't like the result, try again.</p>

<p>If your game gets popular enough, it may be economically viable to effectively spend computing power on mining transactions that game it. </p>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2013-11-26T23:41:59.270Z
2013-11-26T23:41:59.270Z
Pieter Wuille
<p>It depends how the transaction is formed. Typically, the signature is random and unpredictable, but nothing stops someone from using a wholly deterministic algorithm. The time received is not part of a transaction -- how could it be?</p>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2013-11-26T00:23:35.317Z
Thanks. Oops, I was just looking on the blockchain like: https://blockchain.info/tx/a5aeaefcead879c2360f2a0ad2c2469afda91e0954845491a32be8d74dc1f08c. But ya, time received would not make sense for part of the transaction.
Jonovono
CC BY-SA 3.0
2013-11-26T00:12:24.677Z
2013-11-26T00:55:26.157Z
2013-11-26T00:55:26.157Z
David Schwartz
<p>I am just curious if when a transaction is sent and you view it on the blockchain. Is any of that information impossible to predict what it will be?</p>

<p>I am looking at perhaps the time received ? (you may be able to guess close but maybe not down to the second?) or the relayed by ip?</p>

<p>Does that make sense? I am guessing not since according to: <a href="https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/8107/are-transaction-hashes-random">Are transaction hashes random?</a> the transaction hash is not random, but still want to clarify.</p>

<p>Likewise, looking at the coinbase api:</p>

<pre><code>GET https://coinbase.com/api/v1/transactions/5018f833f8182b129c00002f

# Response
{
"transaction": {
"id": "5018f833f8182b129c00002f",
"created_at": "2012-08-01T02:34:43-07:00",
"amount": {
  "amount": "-1.10000000",
  "currency": "BTC"
},
"request": true,
"status": "pending",
"sender": {
  "id": "5011f33df8182b142400000e",
  "name": "User Two",
  "email": "user2@example.com"
},
"recipient": {
  "id": "5011f33df8182b142400000a",
  "name": "User One",
  "email": "user1@example.com"
}
 }
 }
</code></pre>

<p>Could the 'created_at' time be considered random?</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2013-11-26T00:23:00.000Z
Could you comment on what you'd need this for?
Pieter Wuille
CC BY-SA 3.0
2013-11-26T00:26:50.390Z
I was looking into ways you could make provably fair games (like this question asks: http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/8662/why-do-transaction-blockchain-based-gambling-sites-use-such-complicated-methods) without having to release a hash that could be verified later. If part of the transaction was random, you could possibly use that?
Jonovono
<transactions><blockchain><api><block>
Is there any part of a bitcoin transaction that is 'random' or could not be predicted?
Jonovono
# Is there any part of a bitcoin transaction that is 'random' or could not be predicted?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2013-11-25)

I am just curious if when a transaction is sent and you view it on the blockchain. Is any of that information impossible to predict what it will be?

I am looking at perhaps the time received ? (you may be able to guess close but maybe not down to the second?) or the relayed by ip?

Does that make sense? I am guessing not since according to: [Are transaction hashes random?](https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/8107/are-transaction-hashes-random) the transaction hash is not random, but still want to clarify.

Likewise, looking at the coinbase api:

```
GET https://coinbase.com/api/v1/transactions/5018f833f8182b129c00002f

# Response
{
"transaction": {
"id": "5018f833f8182b129c00002f",
"created_at": "2012-08-01T02:34:43-07:00",
"amount": {
  "amount": "-1.10000000",
  "currency": "BTC"
},
"request": true,
"status": "pending",
"sender": {
  "id": "5011f33df8182b142400000e",
  "name": "User Two",
  "email": "user2@example.com"
},
"recipient": {
  "id": "5011f33df8182b142400000a",
  "name": "User One",
  "email": "user1@example.com"
}
 }
 }

```

Could the 'created\_at' time be considered random?

Thanks.

**Tags:** transactions, blockchain, api, block

> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: Could you comment on what you'd need this for?  
> **username_0**: I was looking into ways you could make provably fair games (like this question asks: http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/8662/why-do-transaction-blockchain-based-gambling-sites-use-such-complicated-methods) without having to release a hash that could be verified later. If part of the transaction was random, you could possibly use that?  

---

## 2 answers

### Answer by username_1 on 2013-11-26. Score: 1

There is always an inherent way to control the transaction. Try to create it, if you don't like the result, try again.

If your game gets popular enough, it may be economically viable to effectively spend computing power on mining transactions that game it.


---

### Answer by username_2 on 2013-11-26. Score: 0

It depends how the transaction is formed. Typically, the signature is random and unpredictable, but nothing stops someone from using a wholly deterministic algorithm. The time received is not part of a transaction -- how could it be?

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: Thanks. Oops, I was just looking on the blockchain like: https://blockchain.info/tx/a5aeaefcead879c2360f2a0ad2c2469afda91e0954845491a32be8d74dc1f08c. But ya, time received would not make sense for part of the transaction.  

---

