<p>Running a clearnet node, or even better, a clearnet node that also has TOR connections, has several advantages.</p>
<ol>
<li>It is reachable without using TOR.</li>
<li>Clearnet connections are more direct and thus have less latency and more reliability than TOR connections. Notice in particular that Lightning is itself an onion routing network that already introduces indirection with all its problems. Routing everything through TOR at least triples the indirection overhead because typically TOR will choose at least 3 in-between nodes AFAIK.</li>
<li>Pure TOR nodes can only directly reach the subnetwork of TOR enabled nodes. I can't find the statistics right now, but it appears that a big majority of total nodes are TOR only, but the bulk of liquidity is in clearnet only nodes. This means that TOR only nodes effectively form a closed subnet that it is very hard to route out or into. Which means that running a clearnet routing node that also services TOR nodes as a bridge should in theory be a great business opportunity, though that depends on routing being liquidity aware (See Pickhardt payments, but this basic idea seems to slowly spread through the implementations in several variations).</li>
</ol>
<p>The big disadvantage of running a clearnet node is that you attach an IP address to your node identity which is already linked to your UTXOs in the current Lightning design. This represents a privacy hazard and could also be problematic depending on your jurisdiction if running a Lightning node is ever seen as legally questionable.</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2023-10-20T14:37:55.307Z
Ok so running it in clearnet essentially only helps with earning more fees and being more easily reachable over mobile phone, so to speak. So you completely sacrifice transaction history.
codepleb
CC BY-SA 4.0
2023-10-21T08:52:58.320Z
No, running it on TOR only makes it pretty much unusable. I don’t quite understand what you mean by sacrifice transaction history. Your LN transactions are relatively private either way.
stefanwouldgo
CC BY-SA 4.0
2023-10-22T11:12:18.057Z
Ah I mean privacy sorry. If clearnodes store my IP and make them available, I assumed that others could follow the chain of transactions to see where the coins went.
codepleb
CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-10-01T05:36:45.940Z
Yes, running clearnet means that your ONCHAIN tx history will be linked to an IP address.
stefanwouldgo
CC BY-SA 4.0
2023-10-20T06:57:09.963Z
2023-10-20T06:57:09.963Z
stefanwouldgo
<p>Can anyone explain - maybe in a bulletpoint list - what we gain from that? Will that increase its usage? Or is it more about being able to access it from all of your devices everywhere?</p>
<p>I'm specifically asking for the advantages. But if you want, you can also point out disadvantages.</p>

<lightning-network><full-node><tor>
Advantages of running a lightning clearnet node compared to one behind a TOR proxy?
codepleb
# Advantages of running a lightning clearnet node compared to one behind a TOR proxy?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2023-10-17)

Can anyone explain - maybe in a bulletpoint list - what we gain from that? Will that increase its usage? Or is it more about being able to access it from all of your devices everywhere?

I'm specifically asking for the advantages. But if you want, you can also point out disadvantages.

**Tags:** lightning-network, full-node, tor


---

## 1 answers

### Answer by username_1 on 2023-10-20. Score: 1

Running a clearnet node, or even better, a clearnet node that also has TOR connections, has several advantages.

1. It is reachable without using TOR.
2. Clearnet connections are more direct and thus have less latency and more reliability than TOR connections. Notice in particular that Lightning is itself an onion routing network that already introduces indirection with all its problems. Routing everything through TOR at least triples the indirection overhead because typically TOR will choose at least 3 in-between nodes AFAIK.
3. Pure TOR nodes can only directly reach the subnetwork of TOR enabled nodes. I can't find the statistics right now, but it appears that a big majority of total nodes are TOR only, but the bulk of liquidity is in clearnet only nodes. This means that TOR only nodes effectively form a closed subnet that it is very hard to route out or into. Which means that running a clearnet routing node that also services TOR nodes as a bridge should in theory be a great business opportunity, though that depends on routing being liquidity aware (See Pickhardt payments, but this basic idea seems to slowly spread through the implementations in several variations).

The big disadvantage of running a clearnet node is that you attach an IP address to your node identity which is already linked to your UTXOs in the current Lightning design. This represents a privacy hazard and could also be problematic depending on your jurisdiction if running a Lightning node is ever seen as legally questionable.

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: Ok so running it in clearnet essentially only helps with earning more fees and being more easily reachable over mobile phone, so to speak. So you completely sacrifice transaction history.  
> **username_1**: No, running it on TOR only makes it pretty much unusable. I don’t quite understand what you mean by sacrifice transaction history. Your LN transactions are relatively private either way.  
> **username_0**: Ah I mean privacy sorry. If clearnodes store my IP and make them available, I assumed that others could follow the chain of transactions to see where the coins went.  
> **username_1**: Yes, running clearnet means that your ONCHAIN tx history will be linked to an IP address.  

---

