Offseason Outlook: Baltimore Orioles
By Mark Polishuk | October 9, 2017 at 7:18pm CDT
MLBTR is publishing Offseason Outlooks for all 30 teams. Click here for the other entries in this series.
With several key figures entering their final year under contract, 2018 could mark the end of this era of Orioles baseball. In order to go out in a blaze of glory, the O's will need to address their rotation first and foremost, though other holes exist around the roster.
Guaranteed Contracts
Chris Davis, 1B: $115MM through 2022
Mark Trumbo, DH/1B/RF: $26MM through 2019
Darren O'Day, RP: $18MM through 2019
Adam Jones, CF: $17MM through 2018
Arbitration Eligible Players (service time in parentheses; projections via MLB Trade Rumors)
Zach Britton (5.158) – $12.2MM
Brad Brach (5.063) – $5.2MM
Manny Machado (5.056) – $17.3MM
Jonathan Schoop (4.027) – $9.1MM
Kevin Gausman (3.151) – $6.8MM
Caleb Joseph (3.145) – $1.4MM
Tim Beckham (3.134) – $3.1MM
Non-tender candidates: None
J.J. Hardy, SS: $14MM club option for 2018 ($2MM buyout)
Wade Miley, SP: $12MM club option for 2018 ($500K buyout)
Welington Castillo, C: $7MM player option for 2018
Chris Tillman, Ubaldo Jimenez, Jeremy Hellickson, Seth Smith, Ryan Flaherty, Pedro Alvarez, Craig Gentry
[Baltimore Orioles Depth Chart; Orioles Payroll Overview]
While the rotation has gotten much of the blame for the Orioles' disappointing 75-87 record, it was far from the team's only problem. The lineup hit a lot of home runs, but no club walked less or stole fewer bases than the Orioles. They also played below-average defense: Baltimore posted minus-17 Defensive Runs Saved and only the A's had a lower UZR/150 than the Orioles' minus-4.7 number. Even the O's vaunted bullpen, such a strength in recent years, delivered just middle-of-the-pack results in most categories. Zach Britton's injury problems were the culprit here, as Britton not only missed time but didn't dominate nearly to the extent he did from 2014-16.
It all added up to a last-place finish in the AL East and a looming sense that it could be now-or-never for the Orioles in 2018. This could be the final season in Baltimore for Manny Machado, Adam Jones, Brad Brach and Britton. It's worth noting, too, that both executive VP of baseball operations Dan Duquette and manager Buck Showalter are entering the last years of their contracts. By this time next October, the Orioles franchise could be moving in a completely new direction.
Until then, however, the O's are intent on returning to contention next year. One plus for Duquette is that he'll have extra money to work with thanks to a number of big contracts coming off the books. Between guaranteed deals ($66.95MM) and projected arbitration figures ($55.1MM), the O's have roughly $122MM committed to 11 players in 2018, and they still have six more expected contributors (Dylan Bundy, Trey Mancini, Mychal Givens, Miguel Castro, Richard Bleier and Donnie Hart) on pre-arb deals. That works out to 17 players for approximately $125MM, so if the Orioles look to match their $164.3MM payroll from Opening Day 2017, Duquette has around $39MM in spending capacity.
Let's start with the rotation, as the Orioles are looking to add two new starters to slot alongside Bundy and Kevin Gausman. Youngsters Castro and Gabriel Ynoa have been cited as rotation candidates, so let's pencil in one of that duo (or maybe Alec Asher, Chris Lee, or Tanner Scott) for one of the three open spots. You could also see a veteran in the mix as a low-cost depth signing, potentially even a familiar face. While it wouldn't be a surprise to see Baltimore move on entirely from the veteran quartet of Tillman, Ubaldo Jimenez, Wade Miley and Jeremy Hellickson (combined fWAR in 2017: -0.3), I could see the O's bringing back Tillman as a nod to his long-time status as a reliable innings-eater prior to his disastrous 2017 season.
Jimenez's four-year, $50MM contract was the largest deal the O's have ever handed out to a pitcher, and since Jimenez failed to produce in three of those four years in Baltimore, it's fair to wonder if owner Peter Angelos will ever again be convinced to make such an investment in a free agent arm. Given Duquette's recent comparison of this winter's pitching search to the 2011-12 offseason (when the club signed Wei-Yin Chen and Miguel Gonzalez), one would suspect that the O's will indeed eschew big spending on pitching and rather seek out more modestly-priced options.
Duquette mentioned that left-handed starters were a priority, so names like Jason Vargas, Jaime Garcia, C.C. Sabathia or Miley stand out as potential targets. Other mid-tier pitchers like Tyler Chatwood, Andrew Cashner, Jhoulys Chacin, Trevor Cahill, or old friend Gonzalez are also available. A Jimenez-sized commitment wouldn't be necessary to sign any of these arms. That said, several have significant injury histories, which will surely be of concern to a franchise that puts particular emphasis on pitcher health. Baltimore could also look to the major foreign professional leagues for a veteran, as it has quite a few times in the recent past (see, e.g., Chen, Tsuyoshi Wada, Suk-min Yoon, Hyun Soo Kim, and Logan Ondrusek). Japanese superstar Shohei Otani is the primary potential target, though he'd fit quite well on just about every team in baseball and we haven't heard of the O's being connected to him in particular. More likely, perhaps, the club could look at some of the other players that are under consideration for a move stateside after quality performances abroad, such as former big leaguer Miles Mikolas.
Duquette has frequently waited until later in the offseason to make notable moves during his Orioles tenure, so he could again be patient to see if any of these pitchers' markets fails to develop, in order to swoop in for a bargain signing in February. It's still possible, of course, that the organization could be more aggressive than usual — especially if Duquette feels his job is on the line and/or Angelos authorizes a different approach to take advantage of the remaining window of the club's current core. The new rules regarding free agents who have rejected qualifying offers could also provide a wrinkle, as teams no longer have to surrender first-round draft picks for such signings. Losing international bonus money is hardly a deterrent to a team like Baltimore that doesn't seem to care about the int'l market, so the Orioles could potentially be more willing than usual to spend on free agents.
Adding some big names and showing a long-term desire to contend could also help entice Machado into a long-term extension. Machado's future is one of the major subplots of this Orioles offseason, as the star third baseman is on pace to land a $300MM+ contract in the ensuing winter (even in the wake of a somewhat disappointing 2017 season). As we've seen with Jones, Chris Davis, Mark Trumbo and Darren O'Day in recent years, the Orioles have been willing to spend big to re-sign their own talent, though a Machado contract would be in another stratosphere of financial commitment.
The $161MM Davis contract is already looking questionable just two seasons into a seven-year deal, so it remains to be seen if the O's are even willing to take another dive into the spending deep end. Jones is also the only one of the aforementioned re-signed quartet that was extended prior to actually reaching free agency, and the wait-and-see tactic probably won't work with Machado given the large amount of interest he is expected to generate from some of the game's biggest spenders. Of course, Machado himself may want to wait and see what happens with the Orioles' front office and manager situations before locking himself into the team for a decade or more.
One option that isn't on the table is a trade of either Machado or Britton. An injury-plagued season and a projected $12.2MM price tag would've limited Britton's trade value anyway. Brach will again be a popular figure in trade talks, and it could make some sense for the Orioles to move one of their increasingly-expensive bullpen arms to free up a bit more payroll space. Britton's health may make Brach too valuable for the O's to move, though the team has shown a willingness to trade from its bullpen depth in the past (i.e. the Jim Johnson trade in 2013), plus some of the young pitchers that fall out of the rotation mix could be used as relievers.
Baltimore is definitely in need of some left-handed bats to balance out a heavily righty-swinging lineup, though they're is pretty set at most positions around the diamond. Right field and catcher are the only true question marks since Seth Smith is unlikely to return and Welington Castillo is likely to decline his player option in search of a multi-year deal elsewhere. The O's could decide that top prospect Chance Sisco is ready for regular big league action and platoon him with Caleb Joseph behind the plate, though a veteran could also be signed on a one-year stopgap deal if Sisco needs more time in the minors.
Right field could also theoretically be addressed internally, if Jones was to be moved over from center. Over the last two seasons, Jones ranks within the bottom six of all qualified players in baseball in terms of UZR/150 (-12.1) and DRS (-22). If Jones is open to a position shift, Baltimore could then sign a left-handed hitting center fielder — Jon Jay or Jarrod Dyson seem like good fits — to a short-term deal until top prospect Austin Hays is ready for regular action. Hays has already made his MLB debut and could be argued as a candidate for the 2018 lineup already, though since he has yet to play at the Triple-A level, it would be an aggressive move for a would-be contender to rely on such an unseasoned player out of the gates.
If Jones stays in center, then free agents Jay Bruce and Curtis Granderson stand out as left-handed bats that could represent options. Granderson would require a shorter deal than Bruce, who is six years younger and will probably be looking for at least a four-year contract.
Beyond free agents, the Orioles could also fill their holes through trades, though dealing prospects seems unlikely given Baltimore's less-than-overwhelming farm system and upcoming need for new core talent in the majors. A more inventive solution could be found in using some of that extra payroll space to take on a larger starting pitching or outfield contract from a rebuilding team.
While the Orioles might like to deal away some of their own larger contractual commitments, that's likely easier said than done. Davis's contract is one of the most problematic in all of baseball. Trumbo, meanwhile, is coming off a sub-replacement year and is owed $25MM through 2019, so the O's could have to eat some money to deal him, or take on another highly-paid player coming off a poor season. Moving Trumbo would greatly increase roster flexibility, freeing up the DH position and opening a 25-man roster spot for a player with more defensive value, but at this point the Orioles will likely need to hang on to him and hope for the best.
The Orioles are a fascinating team to watch this offseason, as they possess a fair amount of payroll and roster flexibility for a team that is ostensibly in its last ride with this core group of talent. The emergence of Jonathan Schoop and Mancini as big lineup threats certainly provided a needed boost that offset down years from Davis and Trumbo, and provided hope that the O's may not be as far away from contention as their last-place finish would indicate. Still, without some creativity in fixing the pitching staff, Baltimore's longstanding rotation problems threaten to spoil another season.
2017-18 Offseason Outlook Baltimore Orioles MLBTR Originals
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The Red Sox Suck. We might as well be the Orioles. No difference.
Sorry. After today, I had to vent somewhere.
And by "just like the Orioles" I mean after all that, now just sitting at home watching the playoffs on TV.
thegreatcerealfamine
The Bears v Vikings are on MNF…
kyleschwarbersmom
Go Bears! Go Cubs!
Kyle had a little trouble in the field today…maybe make him a nice hot cup of cocoa
Ah, he was just giving the Nats some false hope. The dream is still alive to hit some homers in Yankee Stadium in a couple weeks.
I'm with you on that…in Dusty I don't trusty
mikeyank55
Yes there is a major difference Gary. Oriole's fans are nice people.
Rwm102600
I think they can easily return to the playoffs next year. A couple SP should do it. One extra bat wouldn't hurt, but just 2 SP would be enough.
Now bring on the Orioles haters masquerading as fans…
CharlieHotel
Which is basically just that one guy.
They need more than two starting pitchers to pass the Yankees and Red Sox
bosoxforlife
You certainly do.
Your sitting home just like him.
xabial
you're* (Sorry I couldn't resist)
But I agree with your point and gave it thumbs-up.
I don't like that bosoxforlife commited this ( https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque )against JDGoat who posted his opinion that Orioles need more than 2SP's. (The topic of this thread is Orioles, maybe BOS which was introduced by Gary in the 1st post, but JDGoat's team was never brought up)
Argue fairly, not personally.
biasisrelitive
if by 2 starting pitchers they mean signing darvish and arrietta I could see them contending for the easy but otherwise the Yanks and Sox are two good. so that leaves the wild card….
CubsFanForLife
Precisely. Two SPs has to mean something more than Jhoulys Chacin or Jaime Garcia. They need front end rotation pitchers, not middling options. If they're serious about giving it one last go, then go all in.
jbigz12
Considering there's only 2 front end starting pitchers on the market and the orioles don't have $250 million sitting in their back pocket that is completely unrealistic. We need to bring 3 SP's anyway. We bring in two you're going to get one of the guys from this year as your 5 starter. They've shown they're not good enough. At least need someone brought in to compete for that 5th starter job. We don't NEED a top of the rotation guy to make the playoffs we've done that before and we could do it again. However, in a shortened series where you have to face chris sale, verlander, Kluber etc. twice you're not going to win. Over a long season you can get away with not having the best SP but it's very difficult in the playoffs.
Meh Sheep
2014 says otherwise as the Orioles beat the Tigers who had Scherzer, Verlander and Price at the time.
The ol pluck an outlier and use it as the norm.
cxcx
The ol call something an outlier without backing it up. At least he mentioned an actual series rather than throwing around cliches about the playoffs.
How about the Royals beating the AL Cy Young and the many-aced Mets in the 2015 playoffs? Or maybe Johnny Cueto is an ace (not sure, everyone on here has been calling him a bum lately.)
The ol dismiss evidence that shows your assertion is invalid. Sale and Price are sitting at home already. Kluber may be sitting at home after tonight. Scherzer/Strausburg frequently are sitting at home after the first round for the Nationals. Toronto beat Texas and Darvish in 2016 and 2015. Royals beat Kluber in 2015. Cardinals beat Dodgers and Kershaw in 2014. Royals beat Giants and Bumgarner in 2014. Happens almost every year. QED.
Do the astros not have an equally as good rotation? Did the royals not have Jonny cueto? When did one example become backing something up? Did the cardinals not have an ace? All those teams weren't rolling out Jaime Garcia's and Andrew cashners. Show me a team with a rotation full of #3 and 4 types that win a World Series. You won't find many. It's against the norm when a team wins with at least one top of the rotation arm. Nothing is a guarantee, it's sports. You have a much better chance in a shortened series when you have a guy you can give the ball to twice. Did the jays win the WORLD Series. No, they didn't. It comes back to bite you in the playoffs when your weak rotation is magnified. 95% of the time and you've done nothing to prove otherwise.
Lol is tim lincecum an ace now? How bout matt Cain?Cueto's 2017 season is irrelevant. He was an ace in 2015. Good try.
Without*
TheWestCoastRyan
When did the Royals beat Bumgarner? If my memory serves me right Bumgarner wiped the floor with them
Royals won the WS in 2015 when they beat the Mets. Cueto wasn't even a royal in 2014. If it's that hard to come up with a team that won the WS without a #1 pitcher you're probably on the losing end of the argument. This got way out of line with what I was even saying anyway. I said you can make the playoffs with a good offense and a bunch of 3s and 4s in your rotation but it isn't going to hold up in September almost every time. You might win a series but it's highly unlikely you're going to win it all without having a guy you can rely on twice in a series. And yeah the giants didn't lose in 14. 3 World Series in the last what 7 years? Wonder if that had anything to do with having a horse you could give the ball to twice? No you're right, probably not.
And this wasn't saying the orioles couldn't have a top of the rotation arm next year, it's just that we don't have one now. Either Bundy or gausman will have to be that guy. They have the potential to be but it's nowhere near a guarantee or even likely. You can't expect that from either one of them yet. They've shown flashes but neither one can give you 7-8 innings twice in a series. Maybe they'll take the next step, only time will tell. It was bundy first full season pitching in the majors, im expecting he'll be able to go deeper into games next year because he was a 6inning starter this year. Only 9/28 starts he went more than 6 innings. And he was worn down in September. But we should expect more next year, how much more we don't know yet.
First you said win a series not win the World Series. 2011 Cardinals Carpenter ERA+ 108 "ACE". Or was it Lohse at 109? Incidentally Cardinals beat the Tigers in the WS with Verlander the league leader in ERA+ of 172..
2014 Orioles: Gonzalez 122, Tillman 118, Chen 111, Gausman 110, Norris 108
So the 2014 Orioles were better than the 2011 Cardinals at starter and no the 2011 Cardinals did not have an 'ACE".
2014 Giants: Peavy 159* with Giants, 101 overall for 2014, Bumgarner 116 and a bunch of other sub 100 guys.
2013 Red Sox: Lester 110, Lackey 117, (Bucholz 237* missed over 1/2 the season and had 0 wins in the postseason)
2012 Giants: Cain 126, Bumgarner 105, Vogesong 105.
2015 Cueto 88* with Royals, 118 overall,
More hosed than anyone except maybe the Marlins or Royals
I think you can add the Tigers to your list and the Giants don't look too spiffy either.
Tigers are finally launching a full-scale rebuild and with the Giants I get the feeling that this year was a fluke for them but if I end up being wrong about that then sure.
That is a completely asinine comment. The orioles have a middle of the pack farm and we still have assets to trade if this season doesn't go well. The tigers are better off because they launched a full scale rebuild? They really got some elite prospects on the way don't they? Candelario and Perez is what they have to show for it right now. Orioles could get that kind of return in 5 minutes. I bet the Marlins are in better position than the tigers in a couple months. Stanton yelich and ozuna will bring back more than Perez, Cameron, and candelario. Also, really nothing to suggest that this is a fluke year for the giants. The team is ancient. You want to bet on hunter pence and the rest of that outfield being solid major leaguers again? I don't. No 3B. Who knows if melancon will be a decent closer again. The only positive is that they could get an absolute haul for bumgarner and posey. But you'd need it because that system is about as bad as it gets.
Bad to mediocre team on the field, bad farm system, refusal to rebuld and best players closing in on free agency. That is what makes a team hosed and all of those apply to the Orioles. You say they could beat the Tigers' return for Verlander but their 3 best trade chips are a year out from free agency so if they don't do that now they will just lose them for nothing. If they keep trying to contend after 2018 they will turn into the 2014 Phillies.
Tigers are trending in the right direction now. They are climbing out of the hole rather than continuing to dig.
Marlins have also demonstrated the refusal to rebuild that is characteristic of the Orioles over the past 10ish years (it doesn't count as rebuilding unless you commit to it). Also, Stanton won't be traded. It will be way to hard to trade a guy who is owed that much money and has an opt out.
The Giants still have the same core that won three World Series and made the postseason last year and Bum, Posey and Crawford are still in their primes so it wouldn't be surprising to see them bounce back. But yeah if 2018 is a repeat of 2017 they would be smart to do what the Tigers are doing right now. But knowing that org the way I know them their pride and loyalty to their players would probably get in the way of that.
Jay Jay Owsik
I love how EVERY YEAR, we're picked to finish forth or fifth in the east, and the Orioles had the most wins in the AL from 2012-2016 making the post season 3 times. Last year, a week into September we looked like the odds on favorite to get one of the 2 wild card spots. Tillman absolutely BOMBED last season, and Britton never made an impact. Ubaldo and Miley were horrible, and offensively Davis Regressed again and Trumbo was a shell of his former self. Yet we still were in the hunt. Our collapse was epic, something Boston fans know more about then most. Yet, the core returning is extremely promising, our farm system probably made a bigger jump than any other in the league, Bundy has top of the rotation potential, and Gausman, well, he's frustrating as all get out but has shown that he can still reach that next level, hopefully he can put together a full season. The bullpen, if led by a healthy Britton, should be better than ever. A guy like John Jay would be a nice get, perfect for what we're looking for. This season, all of our supposed 5th starter depth bombed at Triple A. Angelos wants this as much as anyone. We're going to compete, and return to the playoffs once again. The statement that we don't have the farm to get a big starter in the trade market simply isn't the case! September was hard to stomach, but to bet against this club in such a big season for the future of the Organization with Buck at the helm, even Duquette doesn't get enough credit, and an Owner who is nearing the end of his reign and will authorize the big move going for it all would be foolish
Realtexan
Hope the Rangers get Gentry back. They need a really good center fielder
What does Gentry have to do with someone needing a really good center fielder? Are they planning on DH-ing for CF rather than P?
I've seen this Texanguy say a whole bunch of stuff like that. Don't know if he's trolling or legitimately believes it. I do like Gentry as a 5th OF/ first triple a call up kind of guy though.
Lefty_Orioles_Fan
So strange, a long detailed and thoughtful article about the Orioles and a Red Sox discussion breaks out. Go figure.
DimitriInLA
Sounds like OPACY on occasion 😉
LOL, Yes true unfortunately
the first edition of offseason preview. hopefully the rest will be published before spring training 2018.
I know the term "rebuild" is a dirty word in Baltimore, but the stars seem to be lining up for that to be a real possibility in the near future. They have 2 decent SPs for the '18 rotation, but any team – not just BAL – who needs to acquire 3 quality starting pitchers on a budget in this day and age know in their heart of hearts it's a bridge too far. Just ask Miami how that went for them last winter. Too many factors working against them for this offseason to hold much hope for a better 2018.
I think a better 2018 is an virtual guarantee. There's no where to go but up for the pitching. Machado and Britton had down years. Maybe one of davis and trumbo bounces back and gives us power in the middle of the order. Is it going to be enough to jump the Sox or the yankees? I don't know. It's going to be very difficult to do that. Better than this year won't be difficult though. Yankees might have their own question marks on the rotation to an obviously lesser extent next year If Tanaka opts out and goes elsewhere. Sabathia a FA Garcia is aFA. Leaves Montgomery, Gray, Severino. Much better position than the orioles with 2 frontline starters but they might have a little bit of an issue there.
Johhos
How about Ian Kennedy for Trumbo ? The salaries don't match,but KC is gonna need a bat, the O's need a somewhat solid pitcher, both players could benefit from a change of scenery. Just a thought…..
I've seen this brought up by my fellow orioles fans as well. Kennedy is making double what trumbo will be. Trumbo's owed approx 24 and Kennedy approx 48. KC also has Brandon moss signed for next year to presumably DH. Maybe hosmer doesn't come back and they look at trumbo as a 1st base band aid. But I don't know if the orioles think Ian Kennedy is better than a guy like Doug fister who you could have for less than 24 million. Royals would probably have to eat 5-10 mil and I don't know if that makes sense for them. I don't see it happening because the orioles would also have to get someone to replce trumbo. We could use some balance to our lineup and clearing out trumbo would help but I'm not particularly optimistic it's going to happen.
basemonkey
When the next round of farm rankings comes out, we will see that the Os farm is t as challenged as it's been in recent years. They had a pretty strong year where a lot of prospects took a step forward, of which Hays is just one.
There's a cap on how high the orioles farm system will ever go. It's roughly middle of the pack right now. I've seen the rankings vary but it's around 15-19 range. Which is pretty damn good for not signing any international free agents. We punt a major pipeline to get talent. That's a gigantic hole even if we draft phenomenally. We could Be around the top 10 if we sold off Machado, Britton, Brach, etc. but barring a complete tear down there's really no way for us to get higher than 13-15 if we haven't peaked already. But you are right we have had some guys improve their outlooks. DJ Stewart, and Cedric Mullins look like they'll be major leaguers. Tanner Scott could be a nice reliever.
Of course there's a way to get higher than that: each impact prospect (of which they've proven more than capable of drafting and developing— to the point that they are among the most underrated systems in this regard) drives their ranking up substantially from the middle of the pack.
That might be a little but of a stretch there. Only guys from our system on the big league team that we developed in the minors are givens, schoop, Machado, Joseph, Britton, bundy, gausman and Mancini. And Machado was a can't miss prospect. I'd agree that guys like Mancini and schoop have probably been better than ever could've been expected. Jospeh is a nice backup C. It's too early to know on sisco and hays. And our horrible development of pitching prospects is going to knock us back in that regard. We do pretty good with the little we have but we're not great.
Don't forget about Hunter Harvey. Though it seems like he's been hurt since draft day, the kid is just 22, and looked exceptional in his return in the 2nd half. We'll probably see him up after the break in some capacity if all goes well
masnhater
Trumbo for Parra with the Orioles kicking in some money or maybe a low tier prospect. Rockies can move Desmond to full time OF and not resign the terrible Mark Reynolds. They also clear an OF logjam with Dahl back. O's can then DH Mancini and improve LF defense.
If you don't like that, get Zimmermann to waive his no trade clause, and trade Trumbo for him. Tigers clear payroll and years while getting a 1B with better defense than Cabrera. DH Cabrera since Martinez is unfortunately done.
We've already have parra and he was an absolute nightmare. I'll take Zach Davies back. And nobody is touching Jordan Zimmerman's disgusting contract with a ten foot pole.
nelsoncruz23
No thanks on Parra. We already tried that experiment and it set the chem lab on fire
Mancini, by seasons end was better than average in left. That kid has a future!
The thing that surprised me about Parra, was his Defense! More was expected, he looked lost in left half of the time. On paper though, I can see the appeal of him in the lineup. Moving Trumbo would be nice. I'd bring Alvarez back again if we found a way to move Trumbo. Looking forward to seeing what Hayes could do if we have him in there everyday.
The Jim Johnson salary dump is more like it. Glad we did it but it was hardly for the return we received.
If there hadn't been the Jim Johnson salary dump then Britton might have been DFA'd and he could have been another Arietta story. Weeks and Frietas didn't do anything for you?
Hard to believe we would've DFA'd Britton but ou never know. But yeah not doing it for me.
jlahman
O's ain't going anywhere until Angellos sells team!
Angelos isn't the problem. That's a tired excuse, that hasn't been the case in over 10 years. He's not my favorite, but we're a small market team, the fans certainly don't show up like in years past, and we still spend trying to put a winning team out there, what, outside the top 10 in payroll?
I won't get on him as much as some for the aversion to pitching contracts because a lot of them do end up ugly. If not most. But there's really no excuse for trading international money for low ceiling minor leaguers. I understand he can snag a guy like Milton Ramos(3rd rd pick) for money he doesn't have to spend and he also didn't have to pay Ramos' signing bonus. But you're never going to find an impact major leaguer that way. You might be able to nab a prospect reliever who becomes useful or a utility infielder but what is your opportunity cost? Finding a young international player who can potentially be a Jonathan schoop. You're never going to find a schoop by trading your intl money.
andrew c-f
Try taking a long look at pitchers that the Orioles have developed from their drafts and international free agents into QUALITY starting pitchers. How many can you find over the last 20 years? Erik Bedard, Kevin Gausman, and maybe Dylan Bundy if he can keep it up over another whole season.
Does Chen count? Rodrigo Lopez had a career winning record of 60-58 with the Orioles somehow. Also #29 on Orioles all time wins list as amazing as that is.
Neither of them count due to playing with other teams before playing with the Orioles, although Lopez wasn't very bad by any means.